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Old 10-18-2001, 10:36 AM   #21
Poser
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Default Indian has no guts and no brains

Indian made fours and twins. I don't see why they couldn't make a V-4 or a V-5 or a V-3 or anything else that they could make work.



Triumph originally made vertical twins and triples. Now they make those and an inline four. They demonstrate guts and brains. Look out, Japan!



What is the deal with V-Twins, anyway? It is easy to copy Harley Davidson and try to ride their success. It takes a little more effort to think. Marketing executives are apparently not paid to think!
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Old 10-18-2001, 10:37 AM   #22
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Default Re: Indian Announces V.P. of Operations

There are a couple of American companies making motorcycles that we can be proud of. ATK, and Cannondale. ATK has made great (Rotax powered) bikes for a long time. Cannondale is coming along nicely. They are getting a handle on reliability and weight issues, but nothing unusual for a brand new manufacturer, with a revolutionary product. As for street / roadracing.... Hmmm you got me on that one..... perhaps after THIS Indian folds and the economy starts another boom cycle, we will see a re-re-emergence of "Indian" run by guys like Kevin Cameron, Peter Egan, John Cafaro, Bob Lutz, etc.... They could start off with an aesthetic re-creation of some of the two valve board trackers (with closed loop oiling, good brakes, miniaturized modern electrics, lighting and bare essential street-legal necessities) that would satisfy the nostalgia buffs. Then they could work on some seriously modern & Hi-Tech sporting hardware that would be in line with where the original company would be today.
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Old 10-18-2001, 10:40 AM   #23
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Default Re: Indian to More Aggresively Market to Jackas$es

Funny Gabe, but lose the negative Harley references. We all know why you refuse to ride a Harley, its because you dump your bikes so often it would be too expensive. Try to keep the rubber side down for a change and realize that not everyone chooses to ride or crash what the almighty Gabe does.



Gabe, if you can't afford it you are too fricken poor, get a real job!



FYI - Excelsior was a proprietary bike, not a clone. When was the last time you had a $100 million business plan funded? The business plan and the bike were fine, but the execution sucked! EOS.
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Old 10-18-2001, 10:43 AM   #24
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Default Re: Indian Announces V.P. of Operations

Great comparison - ATK and Cannondale to American clone cruisers. WTF?
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Old 10-18-2001, 07:37 PM   #25
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Default Re: Indian to More Aggresively Market to Jackas$es

Now that is funny stuff!
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Old 10-18-2001, 07:49 PM   #26
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Default Re: Indian Announces V.P. of Operations

I think what really irks me is that a couple of years ago some people with real love for the Indian motorcycle tried to revive it, from the ground up with its own engine and all. But they were blocked at every turn. First because they had problems with the Indian name because it was a brand, then a couple of Native American tribes sued. And the finally gave up.



Then, along comes CMC (California Motorcycle Company), another Harley clone company, and makes the Indian simply a model, or an extension of an existing product, therefore the trademark problems of having Indian as a brand name. Then seperating the two companies later on. It is still just a Harley clone made by CMC with skirted fenders. It is nothing special.



You usually see companies making upper management changes like this when they are in trouble and trying to impress upon the investors that change for the good is on the horizon. I think the stock sell-off was just to raise some quick cash. With the economy going the direction it is I think you will see more of these Harley clone companies going the way or Titan and the Dodo bird. Wait... Didn't Titan do the management shuffle right before...
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Old 10-19-2001, 06:40 AM   #27
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Default Re: Indian Announces V.P. of Operations

I'll tell ya WTF... lazy1's question was "why isn't there an american motorcycle manufacturer making some product that we can be proud of?" There isn't anything in that question about "clone cruisers". The truth is that ATK and Cannondale ARE american motorcycle manufacturers and they ARE making motorcycles that we can be proud of.
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Old 10-19-2001, 09:44 AM   #28
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Default Re: Indian Announces V.P. of Operations

Hey Sean, I finally figured it out. America needs motorcycles to be proud of, not to ride. Get a clue. By your reasoning if I want to buy an American motorcycle to be proud of I have two choices ATK and Cannondale. Both are excellent choices for cruising cross country and for 2 up riding on Interstates, NOT. The truth is both are great bikes, but only for their intended purpose. There are many other American manufactured bikes to be proud of and for street use.
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Old 10-19-2001, 09:54 AM   #29
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Default Re: Indian Announces V.P. of Operations

Actually you missed a couple of very important points. The people (a group of Canadian investors) who bought the exclusive rights to the Indian name bought them from a bankruptcy court in CO for around $17 million. Another group, Eller Ind., was also bidding for the rights. One of the requirements of the court was that the winning bidder actually had to build and sell motorcycles. At the time, Eller had a concept, but no bike. The Canadian investors, bought CMC to satisfy the courts requirement. Eller lost the battle and the winners had to slap the Indian name on the CMC clone POS bikes to satisfy the court. From the start, Indian said they would have a proprietary motor in 6 to 12 months. Today they are many years late.



Fact is, the new Indian is a Turd. They missed whatever window existed in the American cruiser market by not having a proprietary product 3-4 years ago.



A bunch of clone companies have failed most notable Titan and Ultra is VERY VERY close. There is also some new scam trading under the symbol PMCY, what a POS that is!
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