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Old 10-11-2001, 03:18 PM   #1
Poser
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Default Re: NHTSA releases most recent safety stats

I wonder how much of a percentage of the overall traffic volume motorcycles are. I would guess something less than 1%.



I also wonder how much of the increased fatality rate can be laid at the feet of decreased helmet use and how much can be laid at the feet of increased SUV, cell phone, etc. use among the cager population.



Some predictions:



1. The government will try to use these statistics to reimpose helmet laws where they have been repealed.



2. More radical elements will try to get bikes banned for "safety" reasons, and insurance companies will drop us like hot potatos.



3. They will completely ignore the fact that SUVs are just bloody dangerous as are the behaviour that too many cupholders encourages. They probably didn't collect any information about the physics of driving two tons of excess metal with a cell phone in one hand, a big mac in one hand, a cup of coffee in one hand, and uh... How many hands does that leave?



4. Nobody will actually get around to updating the Hurt report or studying non-fatal accidents.



5. Absolutely nobody will make any kind of official estimate of how many fewer fatalities there would be and how much imported oil we would'nt burn if motorcycle riders were 10% of traffic volume instead of 1%.



Ok. I'm going to take my medication now.
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Old 10-11-2001, 05:32 PM   #2
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Default Re: NHTSA releases most recent safety stats

Don't take any medication. I hope your madness spreads to some of the idiots in our government.



Spread the insanity!
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Old 10-11-2001, 06:09 PM   #3
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Default Re: Florida helmet law repeal results

Availability of 2000 data in NHTSA's query system (link appears on the linked page) makes it possible to answer the question: how bad was the carnage in Florida after they repealed their helmet law on July 1, 2000?



The answer you'll hear from the government and other helmet law proponents is that it was devastating. Deaths increased by 46% over 1999.



The answer you ought to hear, but won't, is that a small increase occurred due to non-use of helmets, possibly not even statistically significant. In the first half of the year, when the helmet law was still in effect, deaths increased by 43%, from 87 in the first six months of 1999 to 124 in 2000. In the second half of the year, after repeal, deaths increased by 48%, from 91 to 135. If the 43% first-half rate of increase had continued through the second half of the year, the second-half toll would have been 130 rather than 135.



Now, if that doesn't start a flame war, I've completely lost my touch.
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Old 10-11-2001, 08:39 PM   #4
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Default Re: NHTSA releases most recent safety stats

Run for public office so I can vote for you.
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Old 10-11-2001, 08:54 PM   #5
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Default Re: Florida helmet law repeal results

Some might say that 5 lives lost are too many, blah, blah, blah. I say, the kinds of accidents in the second half of the year could not be identical to the accidents in the first half of the year, so you can't extrapolate that kind of data. My guess is that helmets or not, most of the people involved in serious motorcycle accidents will die.



A SNELL approved motorcycle helmet only has to withstand a 14 mph impact (about a 6 foot drop with a dummy head inside). That comes out to you traveling 7mph hitting a SUV (pick a hated care/object of your choice) going the other way traveling 7mph, or you tripping 'cause you didn't see the crack in the sidewalk due to your full face lid, and not catching yourself with your hands 'cause they were fishing in your pockets for your keys. Pitiful. I believe in helmets, but I wish they did more.
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Old 10-11-2001, 09:30 PM   #6
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Default True, but you measure like tank armor...

These measurements are based on direct 90 degree impacts. I'm no physicist and I probably can't spell it either, but I'm sure our resident collegiate Starving will come up with the formula.



Force of impact is lessened when angle of attack is increased. Me taking my head the ramming the crown into a wall at 90 degress will do more damage than my banging my head in to the wall at 45 or 20 degrees.



Most times, if you hit your head on the rear end of an suv (Volvo, if you're in Europe) crown on, you're dead. However,m ost head injuries on a bike will be from tumbling/sliding down the road, or from impact on the road after ejection from the vehicle. In a situation like this, the direction of force on your head will NOT be the same direction as the object your unfortunate head is hitting, thus lessening the damage by a reduction in angle.



And even if, if i have a choice of hitting my head at 14mph in a helmet or none, I'll take the helmet...and my leathers, and my gloves, and my boots...you know what I mean?



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Old 10-11-2001, 09:31 PM   #7
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Default Re: True, but you measure like tank armor...

Whoops, I meant force is lessened when angle of attack DECREASES. Sorry.



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Old 10-12-2001, 01:23 AM   #8
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Default Re: NHTSA releases most recent safety stats

If Im reading this correctly, and I think I am, you are more than 4 times as likely to die in a motorcycle crash in DC where there are mandatory helmet laws than in New Hampshire, where there are no helmet laws for those over 18, and about 84 bazzillion bikers. (second per capita only to alaska, not a joke) Also using a helmet is only likely to save your life 29 percent of the time. (Read: You still die 79 percent of the time.
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Old 10-12-2001, 02:26 AM   #9
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Default Re: NHTSA releases most recent safety stats

If there are more motorbikes on the road, the fatality rate is lower because car drivers are more aware of them.



If you look at the figures, warmer states generally have higher fatality rates - this maybe is because shock (loss of fluid) from being dragged along the road in shorts and flip-flops is higher in those states.



BTW, Italy has realtively low fatality rates despite helmet laws being ignored.

This is for two reasons :

- There are lots of bikes, and therefore higher awareness.

- Most bikes are scooters. Blood loss from having toes and feet severed in rear wheels is a major cause of death in accidents. Scooters have 'bathtub' enclosures.
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Old 10-12-2001, 04:07 AM   #10
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Default Re: Florida helmet law repeal results

Just pulling numbers out of the air here, but if the majority of the early-year non-helmet wearing bikers in Florida are just there for Daytona, then it wouldn't surprize me that non-helmet stats for the 2nd half of the year would decrease.. there's just not as many of these types of riders around.



Or, have I just not had enough coffee yet?



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