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Old 03-12-2006, 10:38 AM   #31
Fenton
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Default Re: careful there...

That's fantastic.
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Old 03-12-2006, 01:58 PM   #32
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Default Re: careful there...

7. It could not be stated more conclusively that Citizens of the States have a "RIGHT" to travel, without approval or restriction, (license), and that this "RIGHT" is protected under the U.S. Constitution. After all, who do the roadways belong to anyway? The People-At-Large. The following are additional court decisions that expound the same facts:



So does this mean "the people" have the right to drive in any manner or condition they like? I notice that in your entire thesis there is not a single mention of the responsibility that goes along with these rights. My position is that the average American could give a hoot about anyone or anything that is not directly connected to them. They will do what they want, when they want with no consideration for how their actions affect anyone else. And anyone who takes exception to their antisocial behavior is trying to "regulate" them or take away their "rights".
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Old 03-12-2006, 05:00 PM   #33
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Default Don't get your panties in a wad.

There is a vast difference, in both legal speech and in common sense, between the restriction of a right, and the rugulation of it subtending the right and good order of society, pertenant to the advance of thehappiness of The People At Large (not necessarily a given individual). The job of the courts, specifically and explicitly (though not exclusively, they have other functios) is to determine when a law should be taken as a regulation of right persuant to the good order of society and progress of happiness, and when a law has crossed the line, so to speak, into the arena of restricting or "abridging" the rights of The People or The Citizen.



So, for example, it is the right of the citizen to make use of the publc roadways, but that right of the people to remove from place to place is not abridged by, say, organizing traffic into various lanes. Lanes, and lights at intersections, and een seatbelts do are not considered restriction of right (to travel at will) but regulation of right for good order and progress of happiness.



(As a brief aside, this is why mandatory-helmet-use laws may *occasionally* be struck down, but can never be considered unconstitutional, per se. Strictly speaking, the mandate to wear a helmet has never been viewed as limiting the ability of a Citizen to freely remove from place to place, he just has to carry something with him when he goes. Which is the crux of overturning such laws, the argument against being that the requirement imposes an undue burden on the Citizen, not that his right to travel has been restricted. I'm not stating my personal opinion at all, just commenting on the tradition of American jurisprudence. Ok.)
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Old 03-12-2006, 05:13 PM   #34
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Default Re: Think Things Are Bad Now?

As to your third point, you may have something there.



On a certain pacific rim island nation, the sales tax scheme for vehicle purchases has a stepped gas guzzler tax, with the first step at a much lower threshold than here, bikes have no sales tax due at purchase, and no ad velorum tax due annually (they get their plates gratis).



In essence, they take from those who are exercizing poor stewardship of roadways/environment/society/good-of-fellow-man, and give to those that do take such responsibility, even indirectly, for the good of others.
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Old 03-13-2006, 03:14 AM   #35
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Default Re: Cause or are involved?

This is why I think the reported accident rate for seniors is under-reported. How many never report because they are oblivious?



Due to traffic, I was forced to follow a woman in the curb lane going about 3-5 mph while the rest of traffic whizzed by. It took her 15 minutes to drive 8 blocks and do a 10 point turn into the alley leading to the parking lot for her senior's complex. I lived across the alley from her and had to suffer through every inch. When I called her in, she had over 50 previous calls about her driving ... but was still on the road. Her daughter refused to arrange for her licence to be pulled, so I walked across, snuck in the underground parking for her building and left her a note on the windshield. I would say that it probably lived under that wiper until it disintegrated (it sure wouldn't have blown off), but I never saw her again.
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Old 03-13-2006, 05:29 PM   #36
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Default Re: careful there...

Our right to not be killed or maimed by crappy drivers (of any age) is more important than any supposed right to drive. Simpler than rock, paper, scissors.



The very first day I owned a bike, I was nearly a bugsplat on the side of one of the biggest land barges ever made... an early '70's Plymouth Fury III. Old lady pulled out of her driveway, and didn't once look my way as her leviathan placed it's beige wall of steel (complete with it's own gravitational field) perpendicular to my bike at a most inopportune moment. Since I was totally inexperienced, I was actually the passenger, and a friend was at the controls. He pulled a miraculous end-around her rear bumper. If it had been me, the best I could have hoped for would be to head-butt her with my helmet after smashing through the driver side window.
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Old 03-14-2006, 08:22 AM   #37
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Default Re: careful there...

I'm sorry you had a bad experience. I think most of us who've been riding for any length of time have had close calls. Notwithstanding that, I'm so sorry to report to you that your opinion that there is a "right" "to not be killed or maimed..." simply is not extant in American jurisprudence.



There IS a presumption that expecting individual citizens to exercize prudence and caution persuant to the good order of society does not constitute a restriction of their right to travel.

In layman's terms, the law says: You have a right to travel the roads by the usual conveyance, but it's reasonable to expect you to pay some damn attention, and if you don't, we make allowance both for the state to punish you and for the hypothetical victim of your negligence to sue you.



BUT that conviction or money judgement is after the fact of having "killed or maimed" someone, you say. By then, it's too late.



TO the which, I reply: That's fair to say, and the constant, uninterrupted tradition of American legal thought has been that hey, life is dangerous, and no government can protect you from life, thus, in the final analysis, the responsibility for the protection of your life and the progress of your happiness are your own, not the government's.



In (very) short: You have no "right" to not be killed (everyone dies). You do have the right travel the roads (it's in the Documents). You also have the right to make a choice; stay home and whine, or suck it the F* up and go for a ride.
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