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-   -   100 Lawmakers Support End Biker Health Insurance Bias (http://www.motorcycle.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1992)

BMW4VWW 07-21-2003 04:42 PM

Re: 100 Lawmakers Support End Biker Health Insurance Bias
 
Those of you who read this article and thought "right on," might wish to consider the words of warning given by our forefathers. A government powerful enough to give you everything you want is aslo powerful enough to take everything that you have.



Where exactly did the people grant the government the power to regulate private business? The answer is of course there is no LEGAL means by which "those that serve us" can regulate what a private enterprise will or will not offer it's customers.



This is precisely the kind of legislation that we who enjoy the sport of motorcycling should oppose. Don't forget that if the government can force insurance companies to insure us against their will at our behest, government can also force all of us to ride 5 hp motorcycles when those companies start squawking about insuring our "risky" behavior. VWW


MrBear44 07-21-2003 04:42 PM

Re: 100 Lawmakers Support End Biker Health Insurance Bias
 
I agree. This is a very good thing, and I might get motivated to join the AMA again if they put more focus on issues like this.

seruzawa 07-21-2003 04:49 PM

Re: 100 Lawmakers Support End Biker Health Insurance Bias
 
Oh stop it. You're just going to confuse a lot of people.



We need instant gratification now! Whatever we want is a RIGHT!! And we have the right to get the government to give it to us!



Plus we get to make YOU pay for it. Pretty slick, eh?

seruzawa 07-21-2003 04:56 PM

Re: 100 Lawmakers Support End Biker Health Insurance Bias
 
You know, KPaul, the AMA is as private organization. To stay in business it has to give it's members the support they want. So, since so many of the members are against helmet laws the AMA simply has to work on their behalf. Don't like it? Too bad.



On the other hand the ABATE people are also there to fight for other aspects of biker's rights. Certainly they work harder at it than most sportbiker types. At least in my experience.



Maybe you should move to some country where they dispense with such ideas as private property ownwership and just have the govt do everything. Cuba is a good example. They have plenty of doctors there and everyone can see one for free. Of course they don't have any aspirin but what the hey...



And leave me alone Buz, I know I got caught!

BMW4VWW 07-21-2003 05:09 PM

Re: 100 Lawmakers Support End Biker Health Insurance Bias
 
Pretty funny seruzawa. There just may be hope for you yet. BTW those of YOU that are tired of paying for it may wish to visit www.theft-by-deception.com

VWW

Viffer-dude 07-21-2003 07:26 PM

Re: 100 Lawmakers Support End Biker Health Insurance Bias
 
And I doth quote: "In 1996, Congress passed the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act (HIPAA), which prohibits companies from denying access to employer-sponsored health insurance for motorcyclists and those who participate in other recreational activities. However, federal regulators created a loophole that allows the denial of benefits for injuries sustained while recreating."



Here is a PERFECT example of how government interference created the problem in the first place. Much as with Medicare, Medi-Cal, Mediscam, etc. - Government involvement does nothing but increase the cost to the private sector, i.e you n'me. This effort will only add another layer of confusion, and inevitably another level of cost. Remember, the consumer ALWAYS absorbs the cost, one way or another.

gdrazek 07-22-2003 01:57 AM

Re: 100 Lawmakers Support End Biker Health Insurance Bias
 
Actually, the Commerce Clause of the Constitution grants the federal government the ability to regulate interstate commerce and transportation. Re-affirmed in the Supreme Court case Gibbons v. Ogden.



Do you honestly think it would be a good idea for a government not to be able to regulate trade and the type of products offered in a country? Without this right, it would be legal to sell any product that would be profitable, such as crack cocaine to children.


James_Brown 07-22-2003 04:09 AM

Re: 100 Lawmakers Support End Biker Health Insurance Bias
 
"Where exactly did the people grant the government the power to regulate private business?"



Uh, I may be mistaken but I believe somewhere in Article I of the Constitution of the United States of America the government is given the right to regulate interstate commerce.



But maybe you're right. Maybe businesses should be able to conduct themselves anyway they want. Just think, a company could refuse to hire women, restaurants could refuse service to whomever they please, banks could refues to loan money to people based on their religion. What a world VWW is envisioning!



The assertion that the government has "no LEGAL means" to regulate private enterprise is ridiculous.



The business of "rights" is a little more complicated than VWW admits to in his post. Unfortunately, "your" rights and "my" rights bump into each other from time to time and it is government's role to sort it out. If you don't like the way gov't is doing it, then vote them out.

seruzawa 07-22-2003 05:23 AM

Re: 100 Lawmakers Support End Biker Health Insurance Bias
 
If you are buying insurance from a company licensed to practice in your State then it isn't interstate commerce.



The sort of reasoning that allows the Federal govt to set local school policy or get involved in direct payments of welfare to individuals will eventually get us a totalitarian police State. If you think this is just wacko conspiracy theory I invite you to check a little federal activity called Goals2000, otherwise known as Outcome Based Education.



No child will escape.

Abe_Froman 07-22-2003 06:56 AM

Re: 100 Lawmakers Support End Biker Health Insurance Bias
 
A standard argument for the borderline socialist. The interstate commerce clause and even more broadly, the general welfare clause, are now listed as the constitutional license for the federal government to regulate virtually anything under the sun, whether or not it actually has anything to do with interstate commerce or will, in fact, promote the GENERAL (not individual) welfare.



If in fact these constitutional provisions were intended to be as far-reaching as they are supposed to be today, why wouldn't the framers simply include them as the last part of the constitution? Why write those clauses and then proceed to list multiple specific and limited powers thereafter? Why even list specific powers of the federal government at all, since of course it has gone far beyond those listed?



With regard to our "rights":



A certain segment of our society (read: socialists and liberals) has successfully groomed the populace to believe that we have "rights" far beyond the classic meaning of same. You have the right to life, liberty, and property, but not property that belongs to someone else. You have no "right" to be employed or any "right" to healthcare. It would be perfectly constitutional for a private company to refuse to hire women, and for a resturaunt to refuse servce to anyone they please. A bank can do business with whomever they choose. Under any classical reading of the constitution, no one can be forced into an association against their will. Yes, this gives license to be a bigot or a racist or a sexist, but while those things are horrible, they do not conflict with the constitution. The only way my rights would "bump into" someone else's is if I decided to physically force my will upon them or their property.



Lastly, it's not that we don't like the "way" government is doing it. We don't want the government to do it at all. We cannot vote out politicians who disregard the constutition and trample our liberties because our votes merely cancel out the reams of sheep like you that have been conditioned to meekly bow to the brain wizards in Washington so that you might receive your benefits.


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