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Old 10-04-2002, 05:09 AM   #41
Ken_Packard
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Default What a great idea!

The radio ad idea is great. Don't most people listen to the radio while they are driving? How about putting the famous "Start SEEING Motorcyclists" motto on a billboard? What IS being done to raise awareness among cagers (beyond newspaper articles highlighting squidly stunt riding on public roads)? As another poster mentioned above, I think stiffer penalties for drivers asleep at the wheel would also have an impact. Look into the "Motorcyclists Matter" program.



I didn't know that there was a shortage of MSF instructors or that it was an arduous process to become one. Why aren't there any private companies who teach basic riding skills? There are track schools, tours and such...why not basic riding? Maybe because most MSFers are doing it as much for license qualification (assuming they pass) as they are for genuine safety? Harley does the Buell Blast school thing, which is great, but someone who attended one also told me that it was as much sales pitch as it was riding school.
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Old 10-04-2002, 05:09 AM   #42
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Default Re: Motorcycle Crashes, Deaths on the Rise in WA: Blame on SUVs, HOGs, Older Riders

Geez, when you were talking about rolling accessory barges I thought you were talking about Goldwings (just kidding).
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Old 10-04-2002, 05:25 AM   #43
rsheidler
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Default Re: Motorcycle Crashes, Deaths on the Rise in WA: Blame on SUVs, HOGs, Older Riders

Hey KPaul:



Thanks for submitting this.



First, Iwould like to commend the journalist who wrote this piece. Well written, fair, attention-grabbing without undue sensationalism. Contrast this with the article a couple of months back in the LA Times. We need to be sure to give the Seattle Times some positive feedback.



Second, as motorcyclists, we have to take responsibility for out own personal safety -- you have a lot more control over your own actions than those of anyone else.



We can, and should, strive to educate other motorists to be more aware of motorcycles, get off their damn cell phones, stop applying makeup while driving or whatever, but your ability to control that, or even influence that, is limited, and takes a long time to show results.



You can control your actions immediately -- keep your bike in safe working order, wear appropriate safety gear, ride withing your own (and your bike's) limits, don't ride under the influence of alcohol or other drugs.
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Old 10-04-2002, 05:42 AM   #44
KPaulCook
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Default Agree Good Idea CBA!

"Third, instead of the AMA paying lobbyists to have helmet laws revoked maybe they should be running ad campaigns alerting the public as to our existence. A radio ad campaign would be great since that is when people would be most likely to associate the need for motorcycle awarness with the fact that there are motorcycles on the road." Fantastic idea



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Old 10-04-2002, 05:56 AM   #45
KPaulCook
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Default Misquoted or reporter confused performance=weight.

Dave Wendell was my MSF instructor, so I think he was misquoted. Dave himself has several bikes including a Kawasaki Vulcan 1500 Drifter. Probably Dave was trying to make a point that people buy bikes over their capability either size or performance. He probably said "People buy big motorcyles like 1500 cc and weight 700 lbs or they buy performance bikes capable of 150 miles per hour. The reporter probably combined the two statements. Dave is a facts and data sort of guy.
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Old 10-04-2002, 06:00 AM   #46
rsheidler
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Default Re: Motorcycle Crashes, Deaths on the Rise in WA: Blame on SUVs, HOGs, Older Riders

I would be interested in seeing statistics on just how many of the over 40 fatalities are on cruisers vs sportbikes vs tourers. I personally know quite a few over 40's (and over 50s) who are buying Ducatis, Hayabusas etc. Some of these are experienced riders, but quite a few have been away from motorcycling for quite a few years.



Of the older riders I know who have been killed or seriously injured in the past couple of years, there is a VFR, a couple of Ducatis and an ST1100. Aside from the ST1100 pilot, they all involved riding at speeds too fast for street conditions -- especially for the possibly slower reflexes of an older rider. I am a 52-year old rider myself, and these accidents, plus a couple of very close calls myself, have motivated me to retire my Ducati from street duty -- it is now only used for track days.
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Old 10-04-2002, 06:20 AM   #47
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Default Re: Motorcycle Crashes, Deaths on the Rise in WA: Blame on SUVs, HOGs, Older Riders

>>being a motorcyclist ( can I say that Burns?) makes me a better car driver too<<



If you have ever ridden in Europe, you can see tins in action. In many European countries, driver licences for cars are difficult or impossible to get while you are a teenager (in itself, this may be a good thing) and most young people get licenses that allow them to ride 125s (or in Germany, and displacement, but with a extrelely low power cap) for at least a year before getting a license for a real motorcycle or a car.



I think this makes better drivers on at least two counts -- 1) in the critical early learning phase, they do not have 2 tons of steel around them to give them that false sense of invincability etc, and 2) drivers actually DO see motorcyclists, cause they used to be motorcyclists themselves, or at least have close family who ride.



I understand that the statistics on cause of motorcycle accidents in Europe are very different from here -- that cars failing to yield right of way is only a monor factor there.



When I returned to the US after 5 years in Switzerland, I had several close calls early on because I had largely lost that sense of paranoia that you need to survive here. Lucky, it came back quickly.
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Old 10-04-2002, 06:22 AM   #48
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Default Re: Work them stats!!

The problem is there aren't any sportbikes out there less than 600cc that look COOL. I mean, why would I want to invest several thousand dollars into a bike that looks like it's made for a 16 year old girl? It's function AND form, not function OR form.

Cruisers are no different, but take a look at the Honda Shadow A.C.E. 750 deluxe. I was seriously considering this bike because a) I wanted a sofa on wheels, b) It had the looks of a full size cruiser, and c) it was lightweigt compared to its larger brethren.

Now give me a 250cc sportbike with the looks of a larger race replica, and i think you'd have a winner on your hands--Kawasaki, are you listening? You could easily take their Ninja 250, slap a race replica body with a fat 180 rear tire on it, and I KNOW people would be buying that, especially as a first sportbike (I would). I saw a dude on an Aprilia RS50 the other day, and THAT was cool. Too bad the RS250's a race only model--for the price of an SV650, I'd opt for that.

I just put down a deposit for the new CBR600RR yesterday, but I tell you: If Honda had a street 250 that had the bodywork of a streetable NSR250, I'd be all over that puppy. How about an SV650S with a dual exhaust and full race replica bodywork, and a 5.5 inch rear wheel? I've totally gotten into WSB, AMA, and MotoGP since. Make me feel like Valentino Rossi, even though I'm only riding as fast as Grandma Moses. And why do Aprilia 50cc scooters look better than 250cc streetbikes? Just because I'm less experienced as a rider, does that mean I have to look like it?

Too bad the manufacturers think that these bikes would take away profits from the larger "starter" 600s. I know Europe and Japan have such a better choice of bikes, but Americans like more CC's. Maybe we're trying to compensate for something.
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Old 10-04-2002, 06:32 AM   #49
rsheidler
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Default Re: What a great idea!

>>as much sales pitch as it was riding school. <<



Nothin wrong with it being both. When I bought my first street bike in 1976 (a Yamaha RD400), a riding class was included. I think it was a Yamaha USA deal but maybe it was the dealer, but anyway, it was basically the same as the MSF class. Started out in the parking lot riding an 80 or 100cc dualsport around cones, learning to use countersteering, braking, shifting etc. Covered everything up to,and including getting your license (they loaned a small DP bike to take the test, if you wanted). Didn't make an expert out of anyone, but it at least covered the basics.



Maybe more manufacturers should look at something like that.

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Old 10-04-2002, 06:37 AM   #50
gforces
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Default Re: KPaul transformation and other observations...

Perhaps a good portion of the AMA's funding comes from the Manufacturers that want the AMA to make it easier for average people to get onto bikes, not necessarily make it safer (hence the no-helmet hoopla). Most idiots I come across that want a Harley don't want to wear a helmet, so maybe H-D and the AMA see this as less profits/contributions.

The radio ads/billboards are GREAT ideas. The problem is, we need to show the right people how this will benefit them, financially. Has the AMA already thought of this, but hasn't done it? Maybe the management types don't want to do it because they're afraid they won't get any recognition for their efforts and not get promoted...I dunno, now I'm rambling.
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