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Old 04-12-2002, 12:05 PM   #21
Woody650
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Default Re: Burns:: Friday Fanaticism

Well, it may not be against the law...but some of these things *do* affect me, albeit in a "potential" or "indirect" fashion.



SUVs and boats that use a lot of fuel increase our dependence on foreign oil, which can affect the price of my gas, or of the natural resources (e.g. alaska) we may have to tap to reduce this dependence. These vehicles also contribute to diminished air quality, which may affect my health or happiness.



SUVs may also contribute to congestion and present a safety risk to those of us who don't drive them.



Minor points, pehaps, but enough to put SUVs and their owners in a bad light for many people....
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Old 04-12-2002, 12:07 PM   #22
DucButt
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Default Re: Burns:: Friday Fanaticism

Good point. Statistics can be manipulated to support any argument. Statistics can also be meaningless when not taken in context. Sure, our energy use per capita is higher than any other country - I suspect our GDP per capita is also at or near the top. It's like comparing the aluminum consumption of Honda with that of Moto Guzzi without regard for number of bikes produced by each. Sure we use up much of the earth's resources - but we give back commensurately.
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Old 04-12-2002, 12:08 PM   #23
TravisB
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Default Dull point

Your usual sharp writing just lost it's edge. Stick to motorcycle rants; mixing environmentalism, capitalism and political science is way out of your league.
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Old 04-12-2002, 12:09 PM   #24
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Default Re: Burns:: Friday Fanaticism

Hey, Logride.



I was with you for a while, but then you went too far...



"Both [SUVs and Busas] are excess in different directions, and each just as gluttonous."



I agree both are excessive, but Busas get descent gas mileage, they comply with more stringent clean air laws, they don't block the view of the road, they don't cause as much wreckage in the case of an accident (provided they don't crash at 195mph), etc.



SUVs by-and-large get horrible gas mileage, they are exempt from clean air laws, they are impossible to see around, they can't get out of their own way once they're moving, their tonnage amounts to a lot of damage when they go out of control.



Since the SUV adversely affects a much larger circle of people, I believe it is the more "gluttonous."
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Old 04-12-2002, 12:13 PM   #25
Steven_Verschoor
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Default Re: You drive an SUV, You're an idiot.

I second that opinion - sort of:



You drive an SUV, you're a glutton.
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Old 04-12-2002, 12:16 PM   #26
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Default One more thing:

I agree with you about our foreign policy.
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Old 04-12-2002, 12:16 PM   #27
granny
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Default Re: Burns:: Friday Fanaticism

The point is that there is only so much oil on the planet. It makes sense to use as little as possible. Almost every motorcycle uses 1/2 (or less) of the fuel used by almost every SUV. Only exceedingly fuel efficient cars use less fuel than most motorcycles (even if the bikes are flogged and the cars babied).



But bikes are not the savior needed since even though bikes use 1/2 the fuel of all other vehicles, the demands for oil are still such that all oil reserves will eventually be depleted. The demand for energy has to reduced very considerably to a reach a sustainable level. That can happen by finding substantial alternative energy sources, designing more efficient machines (cars, computers, washing machines etc.) and by reducing the demand/usage of such machines.



Finding substantial alternative energy sources has proven to be a thorny problem (the lack of workable solutions shows this to be true) and so far the unreasonably low price of oil (the cost of military action is not reflected in the price of US oil) has further stymied the development of alternative energy sources as well as energy efficient machines.



Although a decrease in population would help reduce the demand, as pointed out, the US only has a small fraction of the world population and it is unreasonable to think that remainder of the world will not attempt to emulate the US in energy usage. Even if there is a significant reduction in global population, it won't happen overnight.



Given the projections that the worlds oil production rate will peak in about five to ten years but that energy demand will continue to increase, it is likely that a great reduction in the amount of energy used will occur but not in the way that might be desired. The supply will probably just run out though prior to that event, significant battles for what remains will likely be fought.



100 years from now our surviving descendents will wonder why we stupidly pissed away all the oil (it is a rich source of important chemicals including pharmecuticals). The answer is not that SUV drivers ride motorcycles, the answer is that all vehicle drivers ride bicycles (and make other significant changes in lifestyle). That doesn't make me very happy as a motorcyclist but I think that's way things are unfolding.
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Old 04-12-2002, 12:19 PM   #28
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Default Re: Burns:: Friday Fanaticism

Good points, Woody. And not so minor...
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Old 04-12-2002, 12:25 PM   #29
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Default Re: Burns:: Friday Fanaticism

I just wanna say.... MO, if u fire burns i am gonna unsuscribe.... best damn commentary i have ever heard... keep up the great work
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Old 04-12-2002, 12:30 PM   #30
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Default Re: Burns:: Friday Fanaticism

Your comment is to commit the fallacy of illicit contrast, and not valid
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