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Old 03-13-2008, 11:41 AM   #21
Cheesebeast
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I found a book in the town dump "still good pile" that is a hazmat guide to decoding the signs/symbols on trucks (and trains). The book lists the agent, chemical properties, etc.

There is some scary stuff transported on the roads & rails. I have always wanted to know what those little numbers meant that I saw on the metal signs on trucks. Now I am a bit sorry I wanted to know!
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Old 03-13-2008, 12:09 PM   #22
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"There is a fire concern with ethanol to consider."

Foam and Ethanol is sorta moot.

I was the Fire Marshal on an aircraft carrier for a year or so. A very entertaining year or so.

OK, Firefighting 101. Fire requires three things: Flammable material, Oxygen and Heat. Some say there is a fourth, called "Free radicals" or some such, but that's in the 200-level course.

Aqueous Film-Forming Foam ("A-Triple F") is not the first choice for any fire except where you are facing a pool of the flammable substance.

The foam acts by sealing the burning "stuff" off from air. CO2 works the same way, but has very limited time before it disburses. This was vividly illustrated in the recent racebike crash video somewhere on this site. CO2 is the preferred application for electrical fires, since it doesn't destroy the circuitry.

Powder (like Potassium BiCarbonate, or PKP "Purple K") works by getting between the flammable molecules (those "free radicals") and the oxygen. It's mostly effective in knocking down flames, so you can get to what is actually hot enough to burn, which takes us to:

Water. Water extinguishes fire by removing the heat. The most effective application of water is called "high velocity fog," which absorbs a terrific amount of heat.

However, petroleum products tend to float, so water doesn't work so well, and hitting "delicate" equipment with water tends to destroy it. Also, with Class 'A' ("Alpha") fires (which leave an ash) the flammable material must be watched carefully to make sure the fire is really, truly out to prevent what is called a "re-flash". This is the same thing you do to a campfire when you spread all the ashes out to make darn sure there are no live coals left.

Class 'D' ("Delta") fires are metal fires. Like magnesium. Water, and a bunch of it, is the only thing you can use to try to put out a Delta fire.

Hope this helps.
I used my Naval fire fighting training to put out a gasoline fire some idiot neighbor started many years ago. I used his garden hose while he was running around in circles. Unfortunately most people are taught that it is impossible to put out a gasoline fire with water.

You might get a laugh out of this: UNDERNEWS: HOME FIRE EXTINGUISHERS BANNED IN SOME BRITISH BUILDINGS

Oh those wacky Brits.
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Old 03-13-2008, 12:13 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cheesebeast View Post
I found a book in the town dump "still good pile" that is a hazmat guide to decoding the signs/symbols on trucks (and trains). The book lists the agent, chemical properties, etc.

There is some scary stuff transported on the roads & rails. I have always wanted to know what those little numbers meant that I saw on the metal signs on trucks. Now I am a bit sorry I wanted to know!
So, you are saying you are concerned about sharing the road with some cranked up trucker pulling 40,000 pounds of aluminum powder? Chicken!
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Old 03-13-2008, 12:21 PM   #24
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This is probably not the best time to point out that REALLY dangerous stuff can be on the road >unmarked< for security reasons.
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Old 03-13-2008, 12:32 PM   #25
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Really Dangerous Stuff?

Like golden raisins? I can eat one small box of those things and clear out an entire hotel. Sweet and tasty little shriveled up pieces of hazmat goodness...
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Old 03-13-2008, 12:38 PM   #26
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Really Dangerous Stuff?

Like golden raisins? I can eat one small box of those things and clear out an entire hotel. Sweet and tasty little shriveled up pieces of hazmat goodness...
At last, the "Cheesebeast" code is broken. Do you publish a list of your future whereabouts?
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Old 03-13-2008, 12:52 PM   #27
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At last, the "Cheesebeast" code is broken. Do you publish a list of your future whereabouts?
Just steer clear of these routes and you should be fine:
FMCSA - The National Hazardous Materials Route Registry
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