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Old 02-11-2010, 07:21 AM   #51
MOKE1K
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See the problem with this entire conversation with you Pully is that youve never done it, so as much as you want to read about the topic until you actually feel what it's like you can only imagine, which leads me to believe you take some things more literally when you read these articles. One reason I already stated that I didnt read the article, I dont need to because I'v felt what that unpredictability feels like, it a minor headshake thats about somes it up. The benefits greatly outweight the negitive aspects of this type of setup. Your always compromising when setting up any race bike. So for this discussion I'll take better grip at full lean angles, and quicker steering for a hundred bob.


Secondly, bringing your rear tire off the ground IS done on purpose! Period! The main focal point here that proves my point is when you do it, you better know your doing it because if you dont FEEL the rear tire coming off the ground, you wont beable to control it and risk going to endonesia, (endo) Besides a racer will commonly push his/her braking markers to attempt a deeper entry(get it?)all the time. The bad thing about concentrating so much on the brakes is you risk loosing your corner speed which is crucial. Alot of late brakers experience this fate. But anywho believe what you want it's no skin off my back Pully.
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Old 02-11-2010, 07:31 AM   #52
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See the problem with this entire conversation with you Pully is that youve never done it, so as much as you want to read about the topic until you actually feel what it's like you can only imagine which leads me to believe you take some things more literally.
Your lack of logic never ceases to amaze me! Do you need to know how to perform surgery to know the doctor did the wrong thing by leaving a retractor inside you? Did you even read the conclusion in the article? Your problem is you skim read, you don't pay attention to the details. I am a details person. Sorry.
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Old 02-11-2010, 07:42 AM   #53
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Thats my point you dont learn to ride by reading you learn to ride by RIDING!

I did not read the article? I dont need to?
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Old 02-11-2010, 08:05 AM   #54
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It's all good Pully.
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Old 02-11-2010, 08:15 AM   #55
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Thats my point you dont learn to ride by reading you learn to ride by RIDING!

I did not read the article? I dont need to?
So, hypothetically, I go out and race. Then I come back with the same opinion as the authors (that the wider tire is not advantageous), what will you say then? That I don't have the years of experience that you do?

Pop quiz! Without going back and looking (no cheating here!), what bike were they using as a test bike? Now what tire size? Now, for all the marbles, what tire size (width) is currently spec'd on the exact same displacement bike by all five major manufacturers? How old was the article? Now, how is it that all four major manufacturers would spec that width tire on their state-of-the-art bikes, seven years later, if a wider tire would be better (even your beloved Suzuki Corp)?

All I am saying is that the author(s) are well-respected motojournalists, with years of experience riding many different bikes. They have trained their minds and tactile senses to notice the subtle differences, and then to be able to translate those differences into words. Not an easy task. Tiger Woods has a "feel" for the golf ball that I will never know, even though I have played golf for years. Just because you have raced does not necessarily mean that you have more knowledge or feel than these authors.

You are comparing yourself to me, when all I was doing is reporting the findings of a publication. You should be comparing yourself and your experience with the authors'.
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Old 02-11-2010, 10:10 AM   #56
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See the problem with this entire conversation with you Pully is that youve never done it, so as much as you want to read about the topic until you actually feel what it's like you can only imagine.
Mokester, as much as I admire your track work, participating in racing doesn't make anybody an expert on anything, other than maybe racing itself. Ok, so you put a 190 tire on a bike that came with a 180 and took 2 seconds off your lap time. Maybe another guy took that bike with the 180 installed and took 4 seconds off of your time.

Remember the context of this discussion: a guy posts that he wants to put a non-factory recommended size tire on his street bike to save some money buying a new one. There is no way in hell that anyone can make the case that doing that is better than putting on the size tire that the manufacturer recommends. The best you can says is that maybe he can get away with it. Maybe it will handle ok. Maybe it will look better. There are no "maybes" in using the right tire.
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Old 02-11-2010, 11:07 AM   #57
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Mokester, as much as I admire your track work, participating in racing doesn't make anybody an expert on anything, other than maybe racing itself. Ok, so you put a 190 tire on a bike that came with a 180 and took 2 seconds off your lap time. Maybe another guy took that bike with the 180 installed and took 4 seconds off of your time.

Remember the context of this discussion: a guy posts that he wants to put a non-factory recommended size tire on his street bike to save some money buying a new one. There is no way in hell that anyone can make the case that doing that is better than putting on the size tire that the manufacturer recommends. The best you can says is that maybe he can get away with it. Maybe it will handle ok. Maybe it will look better. There are no "maybes" in using the right tire.
uuuuh..Yes, but the manufacturers are not always right either. My old GSX1100G came with qualifiers. I put D205s on it and it handled better in all conditions even with a wider profile.

Look at many of the stock tires. And no one can claim that those superwide cruiser tires are chosen for their handling qualities. If anything those overweight things need the best handling tire choice possible. That's not to say that one should ignore the manufacturers. But I don't see that a little experimentation would be amiss. One would of course exercise caution in breaking in new tires and seeking their limits.
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Old 02-11-2010, 11:10 AM   #58
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uuuuh..Yes, but the manufacturers are not always right either. My old GSX1100G came with qualifiers. I put D205s on it and it handled better in all conditions even with a wider profile.

Look at many of the stock tires. And no one can claim that those superwide cruiser tires are chosen for their handling qualities. If anything those overweight things need the best handling tire choice possible. That's not to say that one should ignore the manufacturers. But I don't see that a little experimentation would be amiss. One would of course exercise caution in breaking in new tires and seeking their limits.
As always, Seru, the voice of reason.
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Old 02-11-2010, 04:26 PM   #59
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So, hypothetically, I go out and race. Then I come back with the same opinion as the authors (that the wider tire is not advantageous), what will you say then? That I don't have the years of experience that you do?

Pop quiz! Without going back and looking (no cheating here!), what bike were they using as a test bike? Now what tire size? Now, for all the marbles, what tire size (width) is currently spec'd on the exact same displacement bike by all five major manufacturers? How old was the article? Now, how is it that all four major manufacturers would spec that width tire on their state-of-the-art bikes, seven years later, if a wider tire would be better (even your beloved Suzuki Corp)?

All I am saying is that the author(s) are well-respected motojournalists, with years of experience riding many different bikes. They have trained their minds and tactile senses to notice the subtle differences, and then to be able to translate those differences into words. Not an easy task. Tiger Woods has a "feel" for the golf ball that I will never know, even though I have played golf for years. Just because you have raced does not necessarily mean that you have more knowledge or feel than these authors.

You are comparing yourself to me, when all I was doing is reporting the findings of a publication. You should be comparing yourself and your experience with the authors'.
Listen Iam not for the wider tire, Iv already stated early in this thread that a wider tire is not beneficial for cornering, so whats our disagreement? Wearing a skinnier tire, because in a race situation a skinnier is the current setup, even those moto-journalist would agree with that.
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Old 02-11-2010, 04:34 PM   #60
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Listen Iam not for the wider tire, Iv already stated early in this thread that a wider tire is not beneficial for cornering, so whats our disagreement? Wearing a skinnier tire, because in a race situation a skinnier is the current setup, even those moto-journalist would agree with that.
Moke, I've gotta come down there and buy you a beer. You've gotta teach me how to ride the track. Deal?
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