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Old 12-13-2007, 09:31 AM   #351
Kenneth_Moore
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Harley is changing!

But the fact is that they are responding(changing)to retain market share and draw in new buyers.
Yes, they most certainly are. BUT, they are doing so incrementally, and without (for the most part) alienating their consumer base in the process. To clarify my point: If HD was really worried about Star et. al. having a torque/hp advantage over them, they'd be stuffing something like a V-Rod engine into Softails. But they're not. The Evo engine run was a decade. The TC engine is now in it's 8th year. They're making incremental changes such as upping displacement and adding 6th gear, but it's still a single pin, pushrod V-Twin.

Anaranaja (sp?) seems to think HD is about to go under...the "badge is losing it's luster," whatever. It sure doesn't look like that to me. In spite of the m/c market downturn this year; HD will only make 1 gazillion dollars instead of 1.2.
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Old 12-13-2007, 09:41 AM   #352
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http://www.motorcycle.com/shoot-outs...ing-14093.html

I think I screwed up this link. Anyway, more fuel for the fire. And the most hp/torque didn't win. But then neither did the least.
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Old 12-13-2007, 09:42 AM   #353
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http://www.motorcycle.com/shoot-outs...ing-14093.html

I think I screwed up this link. Anyway, more fuel for the fire. And the most hp/torque didn't win. But then neither did the least.
It's all about MEDIUM.
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Old 12-13-2007, 09:48 AM   #354
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It's all about MEDIUM.
What do you know? You own a Harley you idiot!
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Old 12-13-2007, 09:49 AM   #355
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Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
http://www.motorcycle.com/shoot-outs...ing-14093.html

I think I screwed up this link. Anyway, more fuel for the fire. And the most hp/torque didn't win. But then neither did the least.
The conclusion part of that article says it all, something we all can't seem to articulate here without insulting each other's moms!! Of course if we came to the realization that the article did, quickly, honestly and intelligently, there would be no use for this forum..
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Old 12-13-2007, 09:59 AM   #356
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It's all about MEDIUM.
I wear an extra medium
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Old 12-13-2007, 10:07 AM   #357
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Yes, they most certainly are. BUT, they are doing so incrementally, and without (for the most part) alienating their consumer base in the process. To clarify my point: If HD was really worried about Star et. al. having a torque/hp advantage over them, they'd be stuffing something like a V-Rod engine into Softails. But they're not. The Evo engine run was a decade. The TC engine is now in it's 8th year. They're making incremental changes such as upping displacement and adding 6th gear, but it's still a single pin, pushrod V-Twin.

Anaranaja (sp?) seems to think HD is about to go under...the "badge is losing it's luster," whatever. It sure doesn't look like that to me. In spite of the m/c market downturn this year; HD will only make 1 gazillion dollars instead of 1.2.
Yea, but they will sell you a bike with a 107 engine for $30k. Why even make/offer a bigger engine, 61 hp is fine, right? I dont get what you don't see, they are responding by selling bikes with outsourced non standard HD engines and brakes. Following the lead of the after market/other manufacturers like Victory by installing 6 speeds, and offering ABS. Why? HD riders don't even need them dangerous good brakes.

They have talked about migrating the Vrod engine over to the tourers, why? Why would a guy on a 1000lb HD want more than 61hp??

Unlike what you current HD guys think, HD is feeling the strain and changing to keep up in the market to compete with the "performance" cruisers. They see what you don't, they know they can't rest on 61hp, inadequate brakes and engines that need top end jobs at 30k miles. I've said it before, and now again(that'll really please a few of ya), but if HD buyers were so happy with just looks and didn't care about performance, why is there a mega after market biz in brakes and engine upgrades for HD's generating millions and millions of dollars? Is it for looks, or do the majority of HD owners actually want some performance.

I always did on my HDs, spent mega bucks on it!
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Old 12-13-2007, 10:08 AM   #358
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I wear an extra medium
I imagine that controls all the leakage, eh?
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Old 12-13-2007, 10:12 AM   #359
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I imagine that controls all the leakage, eh?
It Depends
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Old 12-13-2007, 10:18 AM   #360
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Originally Posted by wallace666 View Post
Yea, but they will sell you a bike with a 107 engine for $30k. Why even make/offer a bigger engine, 61 hp is fine, right? I dont get what you don't see, they are responding by selling bikes with outsourced non standard HD engines and brakes. Following the lead of the after market/other manufacturers like Victory by installing 6 speeds, and offering ABS. Why? HD riders don't even need them dangerous good brakes.

They have talked about migrating the Vrod engine over to the tourers, why? Why would a guy on a 1000lb HD want more than 61hp??

Unlike what you current HD guys think, HD is feeling the strain and changing to keep up in the market to compete with the "performance" cruisers. They see what you don't, they know they can't rest on 61hp, inadequate brakes and engines that need top end jobs at 30k miles. I've said it before, and now again(that'll really please a few of ya), but if HD buyers were so happy with just looks and didn't care about performance, why is there a mega after market biz in brakes and engine upgrades for HD's generating millions and millions of dollars? Is it for looks, or do the majority of HD owners actually want some performance.

I always did on my HDs, spent mega bucks on it!
Why are you responding to my post with comments that LR made? It doesn't make sense. Re-read what kenneth_moore wrote and respond to THAT, if you choose to.
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