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Old 12-03-2007, 08:16 PM   #101
seruzawa
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Originally Posted by anrajala View Post
Hmmmm... We are not talking about some cruiser slightly bettering HD in the grunt department, like it was only few years ago. We are talking about every respectable cruiser manufacturer througly waxing the butt of Harley. 43% more torque equals to total annihilation. Absolute humiliation. It never was this bad.

If HD wants to keep the lustre on the badge (which, ominiously, started to peel off in this comparo) it has to start doing some engineering. It loses all the comparos so bad that a Harley rider starts to look a bit of a clown.

- cruiz-euro
HD is just quaking in their boots about being roundly criticized by their detractors. It must make them have to try more than once to get that big fat deposit envelope in the bank each day because their hands are shaking so badly in fear. They've been living in abject terror for decades now because all the experts predict their imminent collapse because they don't copy Japanese bikes.

They still sell more big cruisers than every other freaking motorcycle company in the world put together each year. But the END IS COMING SOON!

LOL!
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Old 12-03-2007, 08:36 PM   #102
seruzawa
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Default You know...

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Originally Posted by Gluge View Post
Aren't all modern motorcycles imitations of inferior older motorcycles? Isn't that called advancing?

Aren't all mass produced motorcycles cookie cutter? Since HD's sell more than stars couldn't you say HD's fit into the cookie cutter category even better?



At the end of the day some people will buy a bike because of it's name and how it looks, reviews aren't for those people. Other people will buy a bike because of how it rides. Why? because some people just want to look at their bike and some just want to ride it.

Maybe once you ride your bike more than you look at it priorities will change.
... You have a point but in my experience out West the bikes that don't get ridden much are sportbikes. I look at the local classifieds and see loads of them several years old all with barely 10K miles on them. When my wife and I tour around Utah, Colorado, Wyoming, etc we see lots and lots of bikes all spring summer and fall. 80% are Harley-Davidsons. The rest are Goldwings, Beemers, various Japanese bikes which are a lot of sport tourers, nakeds and some metric cruisers. Very very very seldom do we see sportbikes... except parked around cafes on Sundays. For example, on a 4 day trip to the Grand Canyon we saw a total of three, count 'em, three in Pace, Arizona on the road and 5 parked in front of a cafe in Kanab, Utah. On a day trip a couple of months ago up a really really great road between Logan and Bear Lake one Sunday we saw once again a tiny handful of sportbikes and HDs everywhere.

I do love humiliating the average cruiser riders' skill on that road with my wife on the back of my ancient GL1100 though. I have to stop and let my friends on their frighteningly powerful Road Stars catch up. LOL!

So I'd be careful with that "Harley guys don't ride" stuff. I can't speak for every part of the country but out here in the land of scenery HD owns the roads.

DISCLAIMER: I am not a "Harley guy". I don't own one. I have absolutely no belief in brand loyalty of any kind.

PS: I cannot STAND Rubbies. I am not defending the weekend warriors and sunshine patriots in their fake tattoos, fringed violet armchaps, EZ-leakers and spotless low miles HDs. Guys who are willing to ride anything are a lot more fun to party with than the stick-up-the-@ss branders.
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Old 12-03-2007, 08:55 PM   #103
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... You have a point but in my experience out West the bikes that don't get ridden much are sportbikes. I look at the local classifieds and see loads of them several years old all with barely 10K miles on them.... (edited)

I do love humiliating the average cruiser riders' skill on that road with my wife on the back of my ancient GL1100 though. I have to stop and let my friends on their frighteningly powerful Road Stars catch up. LOL!

So I'd be careful with that "Harley guys don't ride" stuff. I can't speak for every part of the country but out here in the land of scenery HD owns the roads.
Yes I know a lot of HD's guys ride their bikes quite a bit. My point was just what are you going to spend more time doing? riding it or looking at it? so what's more important to you? Most people probably don't buy this HD to ride more than they look at though.

Sometimes you have to sacrifice one thing for another, but if your sacrificing ride quality for looks... doesn't that make you a poser?

I used to ride a beat up EX500 with a big tail trunk I welded up to it, put 10k miles or so on it in a year. I recently bought a Aprilia RS250, it sacrifices some things the EX500 had, passenger comfort, ease of pulling away from a light, and price. But in return it handles better stops better and has a really fun powerband, and of course it's pretty. I do admit part of the reason I wanted it over the EX500 was looks...
I do love riding it more than the EX500 though and with in 3 months I've put 1500 miles on it, commuted on it every day save for 2 or 3.
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Old 12-03-2007, 09:08 PM   #104
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Hey Bud, they got around by bouncing down the road feeling every pebble in there spine, they left a trail of oil, and if the bike had any miles on it they were lucky to make it all in one go. I've got a 1957 Jeep FC150 truck with a F134 engine(70hp), 7 to 1 compression and 5.34 gears. Do I want to take that on a 500-1000 mile trip or take the leathered out 1 year old SUV out front? Yea, I'll get there in the Jeep but it ain't gonna be fun. If you think more horsepower and torque is not a good thing, what ever you ride, pull one plug wire off and go ride for a couple hours. You'll get a clue.
I actually don't ride more than trails and backroads on a couple of early 70s hondas, considering the CL100's springs are... well useless (not sure if thats true of all of them or its age.) I can feel everything i ride over, no its not comfy sometimes, but theres something so much better to me about riding that than my cousins brand spankin new CR125. Its faster... its softer on the rear but hell, its not the same. Theres something wonderful about that old CL (too bad it'd cost an arm leg and testicle to get it road worthy, i'd ride it to work) HP is not as big a deal as it seems to be, i can get an 11hp CL100 up to 70 on the flat, do i need more than that for riding around back country roads? nope. does the CR get do 70 faster? hell yea. Which do i prefer? the CL, which does he prefer? the... CL! imagine that. Sorry but alot of people including me done see 61hp as a disadvantage.
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Old 12-03-2007, 09:18 PM   #105
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Yes I know a lot of HD's guys ride their bikes quite a bit. My point was just what are you going to spend more time doing? riding it or looking at it? so what's more important to you? Most people probably don't buy this HD to ride more than they look at though.

Sometimes you have to sacrifice one thing for another, but if your sacrificing ride quality for looks... doesn't that make you a poser?
I don't know that it's that big a sacrifice for them. Like I said we ride a GL1100 for our tours and I guess you could say the same thing about that. However I've ridden a lot of bikes and I don't really feel like I'm sacrificing anything. I certainly feel good about not sacrificing $15K+ for improvements I don't really care about.

As far as posers go the biggest posers are on race replicas. Cruyiser guys are pretending to be outlaws but at least they are actually cruising. Too many sportbikers are not only posing as real racers but they are not racing. Double posers. Like the two guys I saw riding Duck916s in matched red Duck leathers in Century City when is was 100 degrees a few years back. Chicken strips showed that they'd never had the bikes anywhere but in the city. LOL! I figure that most riders are posers and a review of the odometer readings of most used bikes will bear that out.

Nah, posing is not limited to any particular bike type. Just look at the army of BMW-GS owners that never ever go on a dirt road. All the race replica guys who've never been to the track. The vast majority of them Just like Hummer buyers that never leave pavement.

Fortunately none of this ever reduces my riding pleasure. I don't really give a frack what anyone else rides. More power to 'em. More bikers, whatever their motivation, means more biker voters at the polls. That's something we may need soon with all the froggy anti-bike legislation that's coming down the pike.
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Old 12-03-2007, 09:50 PM   #106
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As far as posers go the biggest posers are on race replicas. Cruyiser guys are pretending to be outlaws but at least they are actually cruising. Too many sportbikers are not only posing as real racers but they are not racing. Double posers. Like the two guys I saw riding Duck916s in matched red Duck leathers in Century City when is was 100 degrees a few years back. Chicken strips showed that they'd never had the bikes anywhere but in the city. LOL! I figure that most riders are posers and a review of the odometer readings of most used bikes will bear that out.
I think your sort of contradicting yourself here several times.

You argue cruiser guys pretend to be outlaws and sportbikers pretend to be racers and you point out they're not racing, well cruiser people aren't being outlaws either.

I hope you don't expect to see sportbikers actualy racing on the streets anyway, I'm glad you don't. As far as posing as real racers, I assume you mean wearing rossi helmets etc. Would you say wearing NFL shirts would be posing as the athlete? I doubt many will actually think they saw Rossi.

Ironicly my Max Biaggi Aprilia RS250 actually says "RS250 Replica" on it. I guess according to your definition I am double posing because I commute every day on the bike, I've never taken it to the track, never intend to, nor do I ever intend to race it. I only ride at 70% on canyon rides so there is a bit of unused tire. I call it riding with a safe margin on a fun little bike... you call it posing? Please explain.
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Old 12-04-2007, 12:23 AM   #107
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As I said, if you think the Yamastar or whatever other bike is the best value for the money, by all means buy one. Constantly bashing Harleys in this article proves what exactly? no one said HD were the better bike, from the criteria presented in this article the Star-maha is. Well that's grand isn't it? you should go buy one and ride the wheels off it..

As far as what I ride, well I've mentioned a Dyna a few hundred times on here and I have a picture of one from a snow ride a few years ago.....do you need any more clues? I also have a 1200S Bandit, I have owned around 25 bikes in nearly 40 years and almost a million miles riding and yes the internet is all talk and if you don't believe me, well that's up to you.

I can't help thinking you just want to start sh*t on here with your comments, probably what you should do is buy a shiney new Star Motorcycle and learn how to ride it, then go put some miles on before you come back with your opinions..that or sit there and continue trying to look like you know what you're talking about, fine with me either way.
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Old 12-04-2007, 12:24 AM   #108
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>If I had a dog that looked like him, I'd shave its
>ass and make it walk backwards

I am glad you liked my picture. Group acceptance is important for me as you know. Was a good party. At the end I had the girl frolicking on the sofa and the gorilla playing the accordian. Or was it the other way around. Hard to remember the details.

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Old 12-04-2007, 03:24 AM   #109
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HD is just quaking in their boots about being roundly criticized by their detractors. It must make them have to try more than once to get that big fat deposit envelope in the bank each day because their hands are shaking so badly in fear. They've been living in abject terror for decades now because all the experts predict their imminent collapse because they don't copy Japanese bikes.

Yeah, HD could put a nice paint job and some chrome covers on a turd and the sheeple would line up to over-pay for it.
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Old 12-04-2007, 04:38 AM   #110
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Cruisers handle like shyt dude. All of them.
I disagree. I bought a Warrior last year brand spankin new for $9k and it is a competent motorcycle. Will it run with my FJR, I'd say so up to 50 or 60 mph anyway. Does it corner well, yes, but it does scrape the pegs a little easier than the FJR. Is it powerful enough to dice through the cages on my morning commute, absolutely.

The last point is one that had bothered me most about cruisers. I test rode a Mean Streak during a Honda Hoot once and was disappointed in its ability to get out of its own way at highway speeds. Around town it was plenty powerful, but once at speed it was absolutely lethargic. The Warrior has no problem pulling me out of uncomfortable highway situations.

Obviously, with their sail in the wind riding position they aren't good for more than about an hour or so at highway speeds, but I'm comfy dicing backroads all day long on the Warrior (I did have to make a seat modification though). Since my highway work commute is only about 35 minutes it is a great little scoot for that application too.

If the Raider is anywhere near as competent as the Warrior, I would have no problem recommending it for most riding applications.
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