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Old 02-21-2012, 11:03 AM   #11
Kevin_Duke
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What a cool machine - a 2 wheeled Ferrari for the discerning buyer. It is obvious that this machine was created by people who are intensely bright and concurrently manical about motorcycles. Such a rarity to see a mass produced product with such "purity". Looking good on the Duc Kevin!

The pricing on the bike is easily justifiable. I wonder if we are not benefiting from the terrible Euro economy on the pricing front. Wondering if Duc will come out with an 848 version of this. That would be cool. Gotta admit the bike is a wee bit intimidating. Good thing it has an adjustable traction control nanny. I think I would need it!

No doubt there is job related stress, deadlines and general BS, but when you get to go to a world class track in Abu Dahbi and ride a historic and completely new Ducati, well, that is a nice perk
Not that I'd recommend it, but the 1199 would be relatively easy to ride for a noob, especially if set to Rain mode and especially compared to an 1198.

As for a smaller version, Ducati staff were naturally tight-lipped. The most I could get out of them is that they're thinking about one and if it is a good idea in this current economy. Keep in mind that it costs nearly as much to build an 848 as it does an 1198 - smaller pistons aren't much cheaper! So, I'm convinced an 849 version will be seen in a couple of years. There's too much development cost in the Panigale not to spread it into another model.

Yep, there ain't much glory in being hunched over a computer for 8,, 10, 12 hours a day, nor in the 31 hours of travel time it took to return home from the Middle East, but this trip was a highly memorable one. As an F1 fan, I was amazed when Yas Marina was first shown to the public. It's otherworldly spectacular. It was a terrific day at work!

Part of the facility includes the Ferrari World theme park with the Formula Rossa roller coaster that accelerates from 0-150 mph in just 4.9 secs with a peak G-force of 4.8! That, too, was memorable! Check this video to see how even a two-time F1 champ can look nervous while riding it: Fernando Alonso and Felipe Massa on Formula Rossa at Ferrari World Abu Dhabi - YouTube
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Old 02-21-2012, 11:26 AM   #12
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Part of the facility includes the Ferrari World theme park with the Formula Rossa roller coaster that accelerates from 0-150 mph in just 4.9 secs with a peak G-force of 4.8! That, too, was memorable! Check this video to see how even a two-time F1 champ can look nervous while riding it: Fernando Alonso and Felipe Massa on Formula Rossa at Ferrari World Abu Dhabi - YouTube
Holy s**t! That was spectacular. Thanks for the link.

I love the way Alonso was turning his head and keeping the horizon horizontal on the steep banking. He doesn't seem to be unfamiliar with the high-g environment.

What drives the launch? Obviously not a gravity-powered ride.
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Old 02-21-2012, 12:20 PM   #13
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2012 Ducati 1199 Panigale Review - Video

Please discuss the Motorcycle.com article 2012 Ducati 1199 Panigale Review - Video in our Motorcycle Forums below.

.......................
What I have always found interesting about Ducati, is their use of Desmodromic valves (positive cam action to both open and close a valve) instead of the normal arrangement whereby a cam pushes a valve open and then a compressed spring closes said valve when the cam retreats.

We note that none of the world's 2-wheeler OEM's except Ducati, uses Desmodromic valves. So I wonder if Ducati uses this valve opening and closing arrangement as a selling point (i.e. a "gimmick" if you want to be negative about it), like Chrysler with their utilization of hemispherical combustion chamber engines for their high-performance 4-wheelers.
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Old 02-21-2012, 12:30 PM   #14
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Holy s**t! That was spectacular. Thanks for the link.

I love the way Alonso was turning his head and keeping the horizon horizontal on the steep banking. He doesn't seem to be unfamiliar with the high-g environment.

What drives the launch? Obviously not a gravity-powered ride.
Glad to see you back, DD! Hydraulics provide the crazy thrust. 0-60 in 2.0 secs is exhilarating, but then the acceleration actually INCREASES from there. 4.8 Gs don't come easy!
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Old 02-21-2012, 12:40 PM   #15
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What I have always found interesting about Ducati, is their use of Desmodromic valves (positive cam action to both open and close a valve) instead of the normal arrangement whereby a cam pushes a valve open and then a compressed spring closes said valve when the cam retreats.

We note that none of the world's 2-wheeler OEM's except Ducati, uses Desmodromic valves. So I wonder if Ducati uses this valve opening and closing arrangement as a selling point (i.e. a "gimmick" if you want to be negative about it), like Chrysler with their utilization of hemispherical combustion chamber engines for their high-performance 4-wheelers.
I think Ducati sells it as a better way to manage the valve train. Pushing open a valve spring takes HP.

Formula 1 cars use pneumatic valves I believe which is not really feasible on a bike currently.

Desmo valves require more maintenance which the Japanese are unwilling to do considering they have to compete so much more on price.

Of course, now with the trellis frame gone, this is the last bit of Ducati heritage along with the L Twin of course.
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Old 02-21-2012, 12:57 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by AlexKovnat View Post
What I have always found interesting about Ducati, is their use of Desmodromic valves (positive cam action to both open and close a valve) instead of the normal arrangement whereby a cam pushes a valve open and then a compressed spring closes said valve when the cam retreats.

We note that none of the world's 2-wheeler OEM's except Ducati, uses Desmodromic valves. So I wonder if Ducati uses this valve opening and closing arrangement as a selling point (i.e. a "gimmick" if you want to be negative about it), like Chrysler with their utilization of hemispherical combustion chamber engines for their high-performance 4-wheelers.
It's a mix of gimmick and effective technology. Mercedes used desmo valves in its fantastic W196 Grand Prix car in 1954. Back then, valve-spring tech had difficulty handling high-rpm usage that caused valve "float." A couple of years later Ducati's Fabio Taglioni built a 125cc Desmo for the same high-rev reasons, and that tradition continues to this day. Metallurgic advances in spring materials eventually made desmo valvetrains unnecessary at the revs used by streetbikes.

But then came MotoGP bikes that operated at much higher revs, so it was only natural Ducati used the desmo system on their bikes. An unforeseen side benefit of desmo valves in MotoGP is that they seem to be slightly better in fuel economy, a real concern for the class that limits the amount of fuel a bike can carry.
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Old 02-21-2012, 12:59 PM   #17
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I think Ducati sells it as a better way to manage the valve train. Pushing open a valve spring takes HP.

Formula 1 cars use pneumatic valves I believe which is not really feasible on a bike currently.
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Yep, and yep.
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Old 02-21-2012, 01:39 PM   #18
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Adding to the reasons for desmodromic valves:

When World Superbike began in 1988, Ducati was competing with an 851cc twin against 750cc fours. To make equal horsepower they had to move equal air and fuel per minute through half as many (though bigger) valves. And that required lots of revs, compared to their previous engines. Because valve mass increases as the cube of diameter (twice as big, 8 times heavier), they had a much more difficult valve spring problem to solve than the fours. So desmo--with which they had lots of experience--was probably a more conservative and less costly solution than state-of-the-art spring metallurgy.

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Old 02-21-2012, 02:26 PM   #19
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Adding to the reasons for desmodromic valves:

When World Superbike began in 1988, Ducati was competing with an 851cc twin against 750cc fours. To make equal horsepower they had to move equal air and fuel per minute through half as many (though bigger) valves. And that required lots of revs, compared to their previous engines. Because valve mass increases as the cube of diameter (twice as big, 8 times heavier), they had a much more difficult valve spring problem to solve than the fours. So desmo--with which they had lots of experience--was probably a more conservative and less costly solution than state-of-the-art spring metallurgy.
To quote Nigel Tufnel.

That's nitpicking now isn't it?
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Old 02-21-2012, 03:18 PM   #20
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To quote Nigel Tufnel.

That's nitpicking now isn't it?
Nah, more info is good! DataDan is a smarty pants!
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