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Old 12-10-2011, 02:04 PM   #11
seruzawa
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Originally Posted by The Spaceman View Post
I've never heard the term "full displacement" used like that. Was 650cc once a benchmark displacement for a "big" bike? The 650 British twins were kind of the standard for imports in the days Japan Inc. was entering our market, but there were also 1,000 and 1,200 cc Harleys. Where did you pick that up, or what is it's origin?
I think it was used to refer to bikes 500cc and up. I can't say where I heard or read it. Back then as you say bikes 650 and up were the idea of a big bike.
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Old 12-11-2011, 08:04 AM   #12
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The first Japanese imports were all small displacement 2 strokes, The CB450 Honda Dream of 1965 was considered a big bike for the time in the context of Japanese bikes. BMW's R69 was 600cc. As Dr Seruzawa pointed out the 1967 Kawasaki W650 And Yamaha's 650 XS was the largest displacement Japanese bike at the time to compete with the Brit 650 twins from BSA and Triumph and Norton's '67 750 Commando. Moto Guzzi had the '67 V7 in 750cc and Bennelli had the 750 6 cylinder years before Honda's. It wasn't until 1969 that Honda upped the ante to 750 with the sohc CB750, Triumph and BSA brought out the 750 Trident and Rocket3 respectivly and BMW came out with the 750 R75/5. Kawasaki Trumped their own deck again with 750 Mach 3 triple and the fantastic 900cc Z1 in 1969 and the displacement race was on again. The Ariel Square Four of 1937 and the Vincent Black Shadow of 1948 both had 1000cc engines but never came close to the production numbers of the more common Edwin Turner twins of Triumph and BSA and Ariel's own 500cc parallel twin

Soooo... ground breaking performance from Kawasaki is a tradition going back to the beginnings of the Japanese motorcycles in this country, it's nice to see them on top where they belong.

Harley-Davidson floundered along trying to compete with the British, first with the 750 cc sidvalve K model, then the original OHV 900cc Sportster while simultaineously cranking out 1000 and 1200cc Panheads and later Shovelheads mainly for police departments. Until AMF came along and pulled their chestnuts out of the fire in 1970 they most likel would have remained a niche player at best if they stayed afloat at all.
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Old 12-11-2011, 08:39 AM   #13
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Having TC has to be a real advantage on a bike like this. Excellent work taking top spot too Mr. Duke!

Done a few track days and drag racing test and tune sessions. Drag strips would seem to be boring, but I found it to be a bit addictive. Trying to get that extra bit of speed, a better reaction time, a better launch. So much intensity in the 1st 60 feet, and I was just screwing around on my old Ninja 750 and TL1000. The lowered twin was easy a pie to click off consistent runs with by the way. Great bike for bracket racing, where consistency is king.

Can't imagine piloting this beast though. Oh my God... Been meaning to take the FZ1 to Bandimere Speedway, it is just up the road from me. Should be fun

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Old 12-11-2011, 11:04 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by sarnali2 View Post
The first Japanese imports were all small displacement 2 strokes, The CB450 Honda Dream of 1965 was considered a big bike for the time in the context of Japanese bikes. BMW's R69 was 600cc. As Dr Seruzawa pointed out the 1967 Kawasaki W650 And Yamaha's 650 XS was the largest displacement Japanese bike at the time to compete with the Brit 650 twins from BSA and Triumph and Norton's '67 750 Commando. Moto Guzzi had the '67 V7 in 750cc and Bennelli had the 750 6 cylinder years before Honda's. It wasn't until 1969 that Honda upped the ante to 750 with the sohc CB750, Triumph and BSA brought out the 750 Trident and Rocket3 respectivly and BMW came out with the 750 R75/5. Kawasaki Trumped their own deck again with 750 Mach 3 triple and the fantastic 900cc Z1 in 1969 and the displacement race was on again. The Ariel Square Four of 1937 and the Vincent Black Shadow of 1948 both had 1000cc engines but never came close to the production numbers of the more common Edwin Turner twins of Triumph and BSA and Ariel's own 500cc parallel twin

Soooo... ground breaking performance from Kawasaki is a tradition going back to the beginnings of the Japanese motorcycles in this country, it's nice to see them on top where they belong.

Harley-Davidson floundered along trying to compete with the British, first with the 750 cc sidvalve K model, then the original OHV 900cc Sportster while simultaineously cranking out 1000 and 1200cc Panheads and later Shovelheads mainly for police departments. Until AMF came along and pulled their chestnuts out of the fire in 1970 they most likel would have remained a niche player at best if they stayed afloat at all.
Wow, what a great post and history lesson! Great to have smart guys on our forum! Just one edit: the supreme Z1 debuted in 1972, not '69.
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Old 12-11-2011, 11:08 AM   #15
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Kawasaki Trumped their own deck again with 750 Mach 3 triple and the fantastic 900cc Z1 in 1969 and the displacement race was on again.
Great post Sarnali, especially for the youngsters like Moke who weren't around to see it all happen.

In 1972, my uncle, who was only a few years older than me, got a brand new Kawi Z1 and a Datsun 240Z about a month apart. They were college grad presents from my Grandad. He said the Kawi was the "worlds fastest motorcycle," and I believed him after a ride up I-95 at well over 100. But his car...I loved that car...

Here's a really slick Kawi from the UK website.
Kawasaki W800 Special Edition

There's a bikini fairing for it and a tailpiece to make a nice cafe bike. I guess they'd never sell any here, hell they don't even have a standard bike catagory on their US website. No wonder Triumph is doing so well.
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Old 12-11-2011, 11:19 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by Duken4evr View Post
Having TC has to be a real advantage on a bike like this. Excellent work taking top spot too Mr. Duke!

Done a few track days and drag racing test and tune sessions. Drag strips would seem to be boring, but I found it to be a bit addictive. Trying to get that extra bit of speed, a better reaction time, a better launch. So much intensity in the 1st 60 feet, and I was just screwing around on my old Ninja 750 and TL1000. The lowered twin was easy a pie to click off consistent runs with by the way. Great bike for bracket racing, where consistency is king.

Can't imagine piloting this beast though. Oh my God... Been meaning to take the FZ1 to Bandimere Speedway, it is just up the road from me. Should be fun
Yep, it's a good TC package. You could almost ride on snow in TC3, yet TC1 still allows 9.7-sec quarters and wheelies!

I highly recommend you and anyone other riders interested in going fast get yourselves to the strip. It's so fun trying to extract the best out of your machine, especially when there's no cops to write tickets!
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Old 12-11-2011, 11:24 AM   #17
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Originally Posted by The Spaceman View Post

Here's a really slick Kawi from the UK website.
Kawasaki W800 Special Edition

There's a bikini fairing for it and a tailpiece to make a nice cafe bike. I guess they'd never sell any here, hell they don't even have a standard bike catagory on their US website. No wonder Triumph is doing so well.
I'd like to think the W800 would sell here cuz I think it's cool, but I'm not sure it would. Triumph can lean on the iconic history of the old Bonnevilles, kinda like Harley does with its bikes. But if you asked 10 riders, I bet nine of them wouldn't be able to tell you what a W650 is.
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Old 12-11-2011, 11:49 AM   #18
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Wow, what a great post and history lesson! Great to have smart guys on our forum! Just one edit: the supreme Z1 debuted in 1972, not '69.

Mea Culpa, you're absolutely right, the memory is the second thing to go at my age...

Back then I was nuts about Motocross and used to hang out at the local Bultaco shop or up to the Triumph/BSA/Norton shop in Seattle with my dad.


Ken when I was in High School the girls gym teacher who was Japanese and a stunner bought a brand-spankin' new white 240Z. We used to stand under the eves of this garage and smoke cigerettes between classes, the teachers parking lot was right there so we got a nice view of her coming and going. I'm talkin' total package here my friend..totally hot Japanese lady, the coolest car on the road at that time and she wore skirts and tall leather boots...........

Unbelievable, we used to just stand there and drool like idiots.....
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Old 12-11-2011, 01:15 PM   #19
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Bah, humbug....
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Old 12-11-2011, 09:11 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sarnali2 View Post
The first Japanese imports were all small displacement 2 strokes, The CB450 Honda Dream of 1965 was considered a big bike for the time in the context of Japanese bikes. BMW's R69 was 600cc. As Dr Seruzawa pointed out the 1967 Kawasaki W650 And Yamaha's 650 XS was the largest displacement Japanese bike at the time to compete with the Brit 650 twins from BSA and Triumph and Norton's '67 750 Commando. Moto Guzzi had the '67 V7 in 750cc and Bennelli had the 750 6 cylinder years before Honda's. It wasn't until 1969 that Honda upped the ante to 750 with the sohc CB750, Triumph and BSA brought out the 750 Trident and Rocket3 respectivly and BMW came out with the 750 R75/5. Kawasaki Trumped their own deck again with 750 Mach 3 triple and the fantastic 900cc Z1 in 1969 and the displacement race was on again. The Ariel Square Four of 1937 and the Vincent Black Shadow of 1948 both had 1000cc engines but never came close to the production numbers of the more common Edwin Turner twins of Triumph and BSA and Ariel's own 500cc parallel twin

Soooo... ground breaking performance from Kawasaki is a tradition going back to the beginnings of the Japanese motorcycles in this country, it's nice to see them on top where they belong.

Harley-Davidson floundered along trying to compete with the British, first with the 750 cc sidvalve K model, then the original OHV 900cc Sportster while simultaineously cranking out 1000 and 1200cc Panheads and later Shovelheads mainly for police departments. Until AMF came along and pulled their chestnuts out of the fire in 1970 they most likel would have remained a niche player at best if they stayed afloat at all.
Don't forget that in the early 80s Kawasaki and Suzuki were the performance kings while Yamaha kept the overweight XS1100 and Honda flailed around with those V-4s. I don't think Honda's street machines ever competed effectively against the big KZs and GSes. Though the CB900F was a real deal pricewise. Today's brainwashed idiots think that a 750 is a small weak bike.
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