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Old 07-05-2011, 02:45 PM   #31
Kevin_Duke
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Better their Governments go broke dumping cash down a volcano-hole than our Government. It is NOT the job of a National Government to "pick" winners and losers. Primarily because, they're so damn sh!tty at it.
The fact that govts and private industry are heavily investing in this technology demonstrates that some really well-informed ppl believe EVs are the direction we, as a society, need to go in.

The oil industry celebrated last week a massive new oil find in the Gulf of Mexico. While I applaud domestic oil production, it doesn't really change the price we pay at the pump.
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Old 07-05-2011, 04:43 PM   #32
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The fact that govts and private industry are heavily investing in this technology demonstrates that some really well-informed ppl believe EVs are the direction we, as a society, need to go in.
"Really well-informed ppl"? Your naivete is kind of charming.

"Really well-informed ppl" once believed in eugenics, phrenology, Martian canals and communism.

Today they believe in global warming and Keynesian economics.

When "really well-informed ppl" decide "the direction we, as a society, need to go in", you should be scared sh**less. If not, read some history.

BTW, have you read your own sig lately? Because it contradicts your sentiments.

Where is the electricity going to come from? Don't say wind - we've got a giant windmill uglying up our downtown and it can't even power the tiny train station it's connected to. Nuclear? "Really well-informed people" told us how dangerous it is and stopped us building plants. The electric power has to originate from somewhere. It doesn't just come from a socket in the wall.

You're hung up on EV benefits and ignoring the inevitable problems. Like, what will happen to the price of the battery components when 300 million people need them? How much (insert magic unicorn pee substance) is in the world and where does it come from? Will environmentalists stop its extraction?

I agree with you, EVs are the vehicle of the future. Just like they've been for the past 100 years.

The difference between me and the typical EV cheerleader is that if some inventor or corporation makes a kajillion dollars from a truly practical battery, I'll be celebrating their ingenuity, not vilifying them as "Big Battery" robber barons and Gaia rapists. Because you just know that's inevitable.

That's the last I'll say about this. Arguing religion is pointless.
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Old 07-05-2011, 05:59 PM   #33
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When "really well-informed ppl" decide "the direction we, as a society, need to go in", you should be scared sh**less. If not, read some history.
I see, we should instead listen to really poorly informed ppl!
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Old 07-05-2011, 08:47 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kevin_Duke View Post
The fact that govts and private industry are heavily investing in this technology demonstrates that some really well-informed ppl believe EVs are the direction we, as a society, need to go in.

The oil industry celebrated last week a massive new oil find in the Gulf of Mexico. While I applaud domestic oil production, it doesn't really change the price we pay at the pump.
That's just it - the "private interests" aren't investing their own money - they're investing the GOVERNMENT'S money (i.e. "ours") in this whole "green" bullshyte thing.

My own company is doing it for tax-breaks and subsidies - because they get more money BACK than they spend on greentech. That, and the ability to paint themselves in Earthtones. It sure as hell ain't because the tech itself saves us anything, let alone the planet.

And that oil-find isn't going to benefit any U.S. company - without Scroogling, I seem to recall it was Petrobras that made the announcement: U.S. companies are Banned from exploration in the Gulf.
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Old 07-05-2011, 08:51 PM   #35
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I see, we should instead listen to really poorly informed ppl!
Hell, there's over 500 of 'em in D.C. runnin' the country right now. Why the fcuk not?
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Old 07-06-2011, 06:09 AM   #36
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Better their Governments go broke dumping cash down a volcano-hole than our Government. It is NOT the job of a National Government to "pick" winners and losers. Primarily because, they're so damn sh!tty at it.
It is and it should be the job of the government to fund research, develop new technologies, take on large projects and subsidize industry in areas like electric cars. It's been that way in virtually every industrialized nation in history since the Coal Age. Everything from railroads to airplanes to medicines have all developed with government support.

Frankly, I think it's a great way to spend tax dollars.
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Old 07-06-2011, 10:53 AM   #37
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Does the latest Zero provide for regenerative braking? Seems to me you might get more range out of the battery if you slow down with regen braking whenever you can.

And now, a suggestion regarding electric two-wheelers: If a practical front wheel motor could be developed and implemented, it would provide better regenerative braking, because most braking takes place on the front wheel because of weight transfer during deceleration.

We should note that there are motor scooters and motorcycles which are not electric, but which attain 60 miles per gallon. That's as many MPG as even the most passionate auto-haters are currently demanding. If one were to take any of a number of economical piston-engine motor scooters and add a small motor (like on the latest Zero) and battery, one could attain great fuel economy plus adequate acceleration. I would like to see Suzuki or Honda try this idea with one of their motor scooters.
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Old 07-06-2011, 12:35 PM   #38
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It is and it should be the job of the government to fund research, develop new technologies, take on large projects and subsidize industry in areas like electric cars. It's been that way in virtually every industrialized nation in history since the Coal Age. Everything from railroads to airplanes to medicines have all developed with government support.

Frankly, I think it's a great way to spend tax dollars.
But not to the exclusion or even prohibition of other, more-viable technologies. Which is what's going-on with the whole "Green" movement.

And dumping money down a hole, then turning-around and dumping another load down the same hole (with the same results = nothing) is not "promoting the general welfare" - it's Fcuking Insanity.
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Old 07-06-2011, 03:13 PM   #39
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Well, if some people think certain areas of research need to be supported then they should contribute some money. The govt doesn't fund research. It takes money from private individuals and transfers it to others. There's nothing noble about it and those who believe in it are not compassionate nor are they forward thinking... they are simply looters. Give your own money away and leave me out of these boondoggles.

Let's look at govt involvement in tech in another field. One that has standard technology where there are few surprises. Back in the late 50s a guy named Stoner developed a new light survival rifle for USAF pilots. It was very trick and had a state of the art chrome plated bore and used a special clean burning powder so it didn't have to have a piston and could be kept very light. It used the .223 Remington cartridge which was an upgrade from the .22LR AR-7 rifles the USAF had purchased. For reasons known only to God the US Army ended up adopting this hi-tech marvel. To save money the chrome plating was dropped. To save money the new clean burning powder was replaced with standard ball powder. The result was a jam prone piece of shyt called the M-16. Too weak a cartridge for combat. Many soldiers died while trying to clean their rifles in the middle of firefights. To this day that POS rifle is still in use... now called the M-4 with a new upper receiver it is still jam prone with similar instances of failure in combat and related combat deaths that the Pentagon is once more blaming on the soldiers themselves for "improper cleaning". The govt involved in tech at it's best. Or the B-36. Sgt York. The M-1 Tank that needs 2 fuel trucks for every tank and ruinously expensive contractor maintenance. They are finally going to retrofit diesel engines and get rid of the pos turbine engine. The C-17. Yep, govt at its finest.

It's telling that the most vocal proponents of electric cars using what's basically 19th century tech know absolutely nothing about the chemistry and physics of electronics and batteries. Just throw more money at it.

This is why we are bankrupt folks.
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Old 07-07-2011, 08:09 AM   #40
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It's telling that the most vocal proponents of electric cars using what's basically 19th century tech know absolutely nothing about the chemistry and physics of electronics and batteries. Just throw more money at it.

This is why we are bankrupt folks.
We're bankrupt because we spend all our money on weapon systems for a war that never happened, and because we give corporations and elites a pass on paying their taxes.
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Thomas Jefferson wrote that the 1st Amendment erected a "wall of separation" between the church and the state (James Madison said it "drew a line," but it is Jefferson's term that sticks with us today). The phrase is commonly thought to mean that the government should not establish, support, or otherwise involve itself in any religion.

Its.......A FACT!
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