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Old 09-11-2009, 02:16 PM   #111
longride
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Yes, Japan saw a market that was being underserved by Harley, so they jumped into it. That is a fact.

But you said: "If Harley went under in the 80's there would be no Star, no Victory, no Big Dog, or any of the rest." How could anyone know this to be a "fact."

Let's say Harley did go under in the early '80s, does that mean that there wasn't still a market for cruisers? No. The Japanese Big Four would be selling more cruisers, and companies like Indian and Victory would probably be bigger players today than they currently are. And S&S might've stepped in, and Big Dog and Big Bear would be bigger.

Facts are unequivocal. Your hypothesis isn't.
"Yes, Japan saw a market that was being underserved by Harley, so they jumped into it. That is a fact."

Yes it is, and the others jumped in for the same reason. Did you think Polaris had a sudden brainstorm to start making air-cooled, belt driven, V-Twins, and Big Dog and Indian had an itch to make Evo motored clones out of the clear blue? Do you really think that? I think you know better.
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Old 09-11-2009, 02:23 PM   #112
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Yes, modern versions of the Virago and the Madura would be a sight to see!
Yeah, people would really be scoopin' those babies up, wouldn't they? We know how beautiful those early Japanese cruisers were when they didn't copy Harley. Of course, when the Honda and Polaris displayed their original designs, we got the Rune and Vision. Yikes!
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Old 09-11-2009, 02:28 PM   #113
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Originally Posted by longride View Post
"Yes, Japan saw a market that was being underserved by Harley, so they jumped into it. That is a fact."

Yes it is, and the others jumped in for the same reason. Did you think Polaris had a sudden brainstorm to start making air-cooled, belt driven, V-Twins, and Big Dog and Indian had an itch to make Evo motored clones out of the clear blue? Do you really think that? I think you know better.
Your point is not counter to mine: Other OEMs stepped in to serve a need for cool cruisers.

My bone of contention is you stating as fact that there would be no Victory, Big Dog, etc if Harley had gone out of business. No one could say with certainty that this would happen.

Harleys are cool and, being an icon, they will always be cool. If Harley had gone out of business, riders would still want something similarly cool, and manufacturers would step in to serve that demand.
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Old 09-11-2009, 02:43 PM   #114
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Originally Posted by Kevin_Duke View Post
Your point is not counter to mine: Other OEMs stepped in to serve a need for cool cruisers.

My bone of contention is you stating as fact that there would be no Victory, Big Dog, etc if Harley had gone out of business. No one could say with certainty that this would happen.

Harleys are cool and, being an icon, they will always be cool. If Harley had gone out of business, riders would still want something similarly cool, and manufacturers would step in to serve that demand.
Now I know why Yamaha can make 'em so good.

"Hey, that Street Glide is nice and selling like hotcakes. Make an aluminum frame and a huge, badass air-cooled motor."

(Puts feet up on desk)

"What's for lunch?"
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Old 09-11-2009, 04:49 PM   #115
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Spinless, group follower.
Whats wrong with you *******? Do you actually have an opinion or are you just spouting bile again?
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Old 09-11-2009, 05:01 PM   #116
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Moke, they F'n ARE "Harley Clones", dude. All of them are. Even Harley "clones" itself every time it comes out with a "new model".
So why is moke here? just to be a d!ck? I don't see his purpose other than being a ricer boy wanna be and piss people off with flaming comments and stupid remarks with no useful value.
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Old 09-11-2009, 05:51 PM   #117
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I'd would like to see that comparison too. Hope the compariosn is inclusive of some of the additional maintenance costs as well that a lot of newer riders don't concern themselves on initial purchase. Like how many quarts of oil each change, how much a new set of OEM skins will set you back (especially that Liner odd size on the rear), recommended valve adjustment intervals, etc... With the weight of these big bikes it's really hard to keep tires on them and this is something never discussed during initial bike reviews. I know it's subjective to rider styles and environmental conditions but nevertheless a common issue. I'd like to know at least if the new Victory burns through tires just as quick.

My '08 FLHT is still on the original OEM Dunlops D402's @ 16 k miles with another 5k to go I' estimate. Maintainance thus far has consisted of 4 oil and filter changes done by me @ 1, 5, 10 & 15k, 2 primary oil changes @ 1 & 10k and one tranny oil change@ 1k due again @ 20k... oh and in true ol' skool fashion I swished the airfilter around in a pan of gas to clean it and put it back in, I also greased the steering head bearings via the conveniently located zerk fitting..........probably $150 bucks total in 16k miles and that's only because I use the high zoot Harley oil. If I was a flaming cheapskate like seruzawa and used Walmart* Techno-lube or whatever the f*ck they call it I could knock about $100 off that total.....
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Old 09-11-2009, 06:44 PM   #118
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I guess the pinnacle of Yamah...cough Star 'engineering' is an air-cooled, pushrod, belt driven V-twin.
I'd say the pinnacle of Star engineering is the new V-Max. Even you'd have to admit that thing is a beast to be reckoned with. No?
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Old 09-11-2009, 07:31 PM   #119
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Originally Posted by sarnali2 View Post
My '08 FLHT is still on the original OEM Dunlops D402's @ 16 k miles with another 5k to go I' estimate. Maintainance thus far has consisted of 4 oil and filter changes done by me @ 1, 5, 10 & 15k, 2 primary oil changes @ 1 & 10k and one tranny oil change@ 1k due again @ 20k... oh and in true ol' skool fashion I swished the airfilter around in a pan of gas to clean it and put it back in, I also greased the steering head bearings via the conveniently located zerk fitting..........probably $150 bucks total in 16k miles and that's only because I use the high zoot Harley oil. If I was a flaming cheapskate like seruzawa and used Walmart* Techno-lube or whatever the f*ck they call it I could knock about $100 off that total.....
Thank god you didn't have an EXUP cable go bad! That makes all the difference in the world I hear.
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Old 09-11-2009, 09:25 PM   #120
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Whats wrong with you *******? Do you actually have an opinion or are you just spouting bile again?
Hit the nail on the head pal. The question is do you ever have an original opinion of your own, cause every post you type is jocking someone elses thoughts. Just like that little kid that hangs around with the biggest Bullys(LR&SRZWA) so he doesnt get beat up himself.
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