2009 Naked Middleweight Comparison

[Kevin_Duke]

From someone who has ridden many hundreds of motorcycles, including on racdetracks, I'll take the SV650 over the SV1000 any day.

[Kenneth_Moore]

Originally Posted by Kevin_Duke

From someone who has ridden many hundreds of motorcycles, including on racdetracks, I'll take the SV650 over the SV1000 any day.

Why is that, Mr. Duke? Seems like you can saw a board shorter, but you can't saw it longer. The bikes have the same frame and stuff, it's pretty much a difference in stroke, bore, and fueling isn't it? You don't have to whack the throttle all the way open in a curve, but you can't make the 650 go as fast in the straight.

[ericrosten]

Originally Posted by Kenneth_Moore

Why is that, Mr. Duke? Seems like you can saw a board shorter, but you can't saw it longer. The bikes have the same frame and stuff, it's pretty much a difference in stroke, bore, and fueling isn't it? You don't have to whack the throttle all the way open in a curve, but you can't make the 650 go as fast in the straight.

...and you can't make the heavier SV1000 goes through a curve like the lighter 650 either. So one can pounce the other through bends, and the other can pounce the one in the straights. Seems Suzuki needs to build an SV800.

Actually the only differences is engine weight, rear swingarm, front forks, rear wheel, and slightly larger frame. Fairings, tank, tail, are the same (don't remember about subframe). All this adds up to more torque and horse, but also slower handling. Since there's no Japanese company putting out a 750-800cc Vtwin (because Italy, Germany, and Austria are too $$$), you either have to like twisties enough to fuss about the freeway, or like the freeway enough to be sub-650-par in the twisties. Maybe Marchesini, brembo, LSL bars, and Ohlins would make the 1000 handle "quick enough," but imagine again what those items would do for a 650, and cost less in the end. I suspect the aftermarket is full enough to turn either one into whatever you want it to be with a little fuss on the freeway or curves, but not the best of both.

So drop the SV1000 motor and tranny into a Duc Monster 1100S and Voila!

[seruzawa]

Originally Posted by ericrosten

...and you can't make the heavier SV1000 goes through a curve like the lighter 650 either. So one can pounce the other through bends, and the other can pounce the one in the straights. Seems Suzuki needs to build an SV800.

Actually the only differences is engine weight, rear swingarm, front forks, rear wheel, and slightly larger frame. Fairings, tank, tail, are the same (don't remember about subframe). All this adds up to more torque and horse, but also slower handling. Since there's no Japanese company putting out a 750-800cc Vtwin (because Italy, Germany, and Austria are too $$$), you either have to like twisties enough to fuss about the freeway, or like the freeway enough to be sub-650-par in the twisties. Maybe Marchesini, brembo, LSL bars, and Ohlins would make the 1000 handle "quick enough," but imagine again what those items would do for a 650, and cost less in the end. I suspect the aftermarket is full enough to turn either one into whatever you want it to be with a little fuss on the freeway or curves, but not the best of both.

So drop the SV1000 motor and tranny into a Duc Monster 1100S and Voila!

Interesting. I know a guy who sold a DL1000 and bought a DL650 for that very reason. He said that the 650 was just fine for him on the fwy. And when you think about it the stock hp of the DL650 is plenty enough for one-up touring.

Where Ken lives there's no need for handling ability.

[Kenneth_Moore]

Originally Posted by seruzawa

Interesting. I know a guy who sold a DL1000 and bought a DL650 for that very reason. He said that the 650 was just fine for him on the fwy. And when you think about it the stock hp of the DL650 is plenty enough for one-up touring.

Where Ken lives there's no need for handling ability.

I say bullshirt. The difference in weight between a DL650 and DL1000 is 46 lbs. Is that really going to make a perceptible difference in handling? Maybe on the track when you're scraping your knee, but not on the street.

We have some very interesting highway interchanges if you want to pull some gee's. And there's that curve in the road down by Deerfield Beach that everybody likes; it's awesome!

[Buzglyd]

Originally Posted by Kenneth_Moore

I say bullshirt. The difference in weight between a DL650 and DL1000 is 46 lbs. Is that really going to make a perceptible difference in handling? Maybe on the track when you're scraping your knee, but not on the street.

We have some very interesting highway interchanges if you want to pull some gee's. And there's that curve in the road down by Deerfield Beach that everybody likes; it's awesome!

I always chuckle when I'm in FL and see the guys riding Sportbikes up and down A1A. The tire is totally flat in the center but at least they look squidly!

[seruzawa]

Originally Posted by Kenneth_Moore

I say bullshirt. The difference in weight between a DL650 and DL1000 is 46 lbs. Is that really going to make a perceptible difference in handling? Maybe on the track when you're scraping your knee, but not on the street.

We have some very interesting highway interchanges if you want to pull some gee's. And there's that curve in the road down by Deerfield Beach that everybody likes; it's awesome!

Wow! You actually have a curve in a road? Excellent.

All I know is what the DL650 guy told me. It might be that the less flywheel effect contributes also. I guess the only way to really know is to ride them back to back. I have ridden the DL1000 and if I wasn't more interested in the Tiger the DL1000 would definitely be on the short list. If someone only owns one motorcycle it would be hard to find a better choice than the DL.

[cloud9]

Originally Posted by Kevin_Duke

From someone who has ridden many hundreds of motorcycles, including on racdetracks, I'll take the SV650 over the SV1000 any day.

That's makes the sv650 seem even more enticing. Thanks for your input duke.

[Kevin_Duke]

Originally Posted by Kenneth_Moore

Why is that, Mr. Duke? Seems like you can saw a board shorter, but you can't saw it longer. The bikes have the same frame and stuff, it's pretty much a difference in stroke, bore, and fueling isn't it? You don't have to whack the throttle all the way open in a curve, but you can't make the 650 go as fast in the straight.

I believe the SVs have diff frames. Regardless, doing a series of corners on the 650 vs the 1000 will show a huge difference in handling qualities, with the little bike feeling much more nimble and confidence inspiring. If you ride in an area with few curves, one could make a case for the 1000. But the 650 is so tossable that it is a much more grin-inducing bike anywhere you're leaning it over. Plus, I don't find it underpowered. Also, most of the SV1000s sold were the S models, and I prefer the more open ergonomics of the non-S SVs.

[Kevin_Duke]

Originally Posted by cloud9

That's makes the sv650 seem even more enticing. Thanks for your input duke.

Glad to help! To repeat something I've said for several years, I could see myself owning an SV650 one day, and I can't recall another bike I can say the same thing about. It's one of the best bikes of all time.

And speaking of underpowered bikes, I'll be racing a Buell XB12R in the MotoGT race this weekend at Road America. Wish me luck!