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Old 02-09-2009, 08:36 PM   #21
trenttheuncatchable
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The one liter bike that might actually make sense in terms of street riding and torque is the SV1000S. It also should cost less in terms of insurance.
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Old 02-10-2009, 05:20 AM   #22
MOKE1K
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Originally Posted by jftoast View Post
The reason i was going to get a 1000cc is because i didn't think there was that big of a difference between the sv650 and other 600cc bikes. But if there is I will only get a 600cc bike, no liter bike right now. So out of the gsxr 600, cbr600, and triumph 675 which is the better ride (pros and cons of each if you have any). Thanks
Good job! At least you have more smarts than some so called experienced riders in here? Sad I know. Listen Dr. Dummy probably has no real world experience on any of these liters. Which is why he's comparing steering dampners and novice riders with proessional racers.
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Old 02-10-2009, 05:29 AM   #23
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Pulley, you are starting to get worked up! Can I throw a stone or two at ABS while we are on the subject??
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Old 02-10-2009, 05:43 AM   #24
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The jump from a 500/650 to a liter superbike was a bad idea. Glad you nixed it. Of the two/three bikes to choose from I will say the following: The Honda will be the easiest to play with on the street and will have excellent track day manners. Not the fastest at the track but a hoot to ride, nonetheless. The Triumph is unique and tons of fun at the track. A little harsh on the street, but with a two year factory warranty and good resale value you wouldn't be in bad shape picking this bike. BUT if you want to earn your hard-core stripes and do lots of track days and mountain riding the Suzuki GSXR750 is the best platform on the face of the planet. The most underrated bike on the planet- anybody that's been on one will tell you that this bike will hang with any liter bike on the track when in the proper hands.
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Old 02-10-2009, 05:54 AM   #25
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Originally Posted by Dr_Sprocket View Post
Your logic, or lack thereof is astounding. I guess you're not in favor of traction control in professional racing? Since traction control is to help the riders not lose control because they "can't control the throttle", you are a better rider than them? Yeah... right...

Let's take it a step further, shall we? Slipper clutches. Those are for people who can't control their throttle, brake and gear position changes properly, right? Newbs. Okay, how about steering dampers? You only need a steering damper if you can't control your bike, right? What kind of bike do you have, Moke? GSX-R 1000? With what, a steering damper and slipper clutch? I guess you replaced those as soon as you got the bike, right? 'Cause we all know you have excellent skillz and don't have any need for these things.

Based on your logic, I'd guess you're in favor of tiered licensing, right?

My logic huh, so every rider that has a year or so under their belt should go out and buy a liter bike? Is that what your saying, I think it is. But only because its got some stupid switch that is not real traction control? See I was correct, you dont know how this switch works, at all.

Its nothing like what professional racers are using? Apparently your analogies need to be explained to you cause according to your answers they make no sence.
1. A slipper clutch prevents the tire from locking up under heavy downshifting? So that you enter the turn more smoothly. It doesnt have too much to do with throttle control? And isnt going to save a new rider?

2.Steering dampner is for when the bike is under such heavy acceleration that the front tires floating but still touching the ground and causing the head of the bike to shake giving you a high speed wobble. A dampner isnt going to help the novice rider control his/her bike? The rider controls that, with the throttle? How long have you even rode?

Listen Dr. bad advice, these features have nothing to do with saving a new rider from a lack of experience. They are there for people who know what there are for and know how to use them? And yes I use them, you cant ride fast without these items, but first you have to understand how they work and what they are used for????

A couple of weeks ago you were the person who thought bringing up the rear tire didnt even happen, go study a little. Better yet go ride one of these bikes so you get a real understanding of what kind of power they truly have, then maybe you will not give such bad advice?

As for tiered licencing yes Iam all for it, seems to work abroad very well. Imo you should be the first one tested with all your messed up logic thats spewing out of your mouth?
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Old 02-10-2009, 09:11 AM   #26
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Me-rowwwwww!
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Old 02-10-2009, 07:09 PM   #27
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Thanks for all your guys help. Ive decided on getting the honda cbr600. They have an 08 cbr600 for $7120 with only 1000 miles at the dealership so im getting that one.
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Old 02-10-2009, 09:04 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by MOKE1K View Post
My logic huh, so every rider that has a year or so under their belt should go out and buy a liter bike? Is that what your saying, I think it is. But only because its got some stupid switch that is not real traction control? See I was correct, you dont know how this switch works, at all.
No, one year riders should NOT get liter bikes. Please re-read my original post. My point was (and let me be clear so YOU can understand) is that ALL of the devices mentioned have been developed to help the rider control the bike better -- INCLUDING the A/B/C mode button. If a "nub" is hellbent set on getting a liter bike, why NOT point him to one that will allow him to control the throttle with a switch? You have not presented any argument against the button, only made attacks at me.

Allow me to quote myself:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr_Sprocket View Post
The important question is not WHAT bike but, rather, WHY do you think it's time to move up?

The GS500F is a nice bike and I doubt you can use all of it's capabilities yet. If you insist on moving up, then please consider the new class of Super Sport bikes (600-675 cc). The GS500F makes, what, 50+ hp. The new supersports make 100+ hp.

Bikes to consider: Suzuki SV650S, Buell CityX, Honda 599, Buell XB9S
Quote:
Originally Posted by MOKE1K View Post
1. A slipper clutch prevents the tire from locking up under heavy downshifting? So that you enter the turn more smoothly. It doesnt have too much to do with throttle control? And isnt going to save a new rider?
I never said a slipper clutch was traction control. Please re-read my post.

The slipper clutch was designed to save riders from locking up the rear wheel, experienced OR novice. It is a safety feature designed to prevent loss of control. Let me point out the logic to you. By your logic, you propose that no-one should need an A/B/C button. If they can't control the bike as it is, they shouldn't ride it. Right?

I suggest by that one could make the identical argument for ANY advancement with regard to safety. Old timers who never had a slipper clutch could argue that if a rider locks up the rear going into a corner and highsides, that is their fault due to lack of proper riding technique. They might say, "Skilled riders don't need slipper clutches." Sound familiar? Skilled riders don't need A/B/C mode buttons. The truth is that designers know people are fallible (yes, you too) and that they make incorrect rider inputs that can be catastrophic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MOKE1K View Post
A couple of weeks ago you were the person who thought bringing up the rear tire didnt even happen, go study a little.
I did NOT say, nor can you provide any proof, that I said the rear tire thing didn't even happen. Again, allow me to repost the dialogue:

Moke: "Some of the tracks I'v ridden, you can only cut a good lap time if your braking so hard and deep that your rear tire come's off the ground braking up to certain turns. This usually would ensure a good lap time."

Dr. Sprocket: "I have never raced. So take this for what you will.

I have watched three seasons of Moto GP on Speed channel, both small bikes and the big boys. I have never seen any of the, what is arguably the world's best, riders consistently brake so hard their rear tire is coming off the ground. Perhaps it's your technique? (And please don't post a picture as an example, because this will not prove your point.)

I posit that if their rear tire is coming off the ground during a race that this is an "oh sh*t" moment."

You must have missed the key operand word "consistently". You argued that in order to make good time you need to do that. You are wrong. Again, let me quote myself:

Dr. Sprocket: "Sure it happens. I don't argue that at all. I just argue the point that doing it will make your lap times faster (ideal), as Moke is implying. Sorry, Mokester."

Finally (with apologies to everyone else who had to suffer through this), you have only proven that you do not pay attention to detail. Either that, or you can't read.
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Old 02-11-2009, 07:06 PM   #29
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First off my "attacks on you" are not that, thay are on the bad advice you seem to want to pound into my head. I find it useless to argue with someone that,
1. Doesnt understand how the switch even works.
2. Has never even rode one. And has never experienced the different settings.

If you'd had you would agree with me. These are not features that make an inexperienced rider control the bike better? These are features that have been developed to make a professional racer go faster. If you believe that any of these features are for the street, that's got to be were our problem lies. This is not a street bike, its a full bred race machine with turn signals and a tail light to make it legal for the street.

These items are not for people who need help controlling the bike, these items rather are for people who can utilize them to go faster, people who dont need more control, but more freedom. Freedom to roll into corners 10mph faster than ever before, because they know how to utilize a slipper clutch. Riders that know if they have a steering dampner know that they can accelerate earlier coming out of a corner then they ever could without one.
These are NOT SAFTEY FEATURES, these are features to make the rider go faster.

These components are not installed to help the rider control the machine but rather give it and them the ability to go faster, with less violence.
Thats what these features are for and about, to race, not so a begginner can learn to curtail the power because he can't ride when it's in full respect mode?

Giving advice like that imo opinion is bad, very bad. You know why? Cause Iv seen the outcome of this advice, given by salesman? Its happened a few times, at my very own shop and others. Crashed in a week, and had it in C mode? "THAT COSTS YOU AND I MONEY IN INS. PREMIUMS, HELLO?

Imo the switch really isnt traction control, and by the way I think its wrong to have traction control in "most" venues of motorcycle roadracing. All "this" switch does is keep the butterflys closed as so to sufficate the injectors at different RPMS in different modes. That is not a different map, its a gimicky way to mimic a different map. Not true traction control.

[Dr Sprcket] No, one year riders should NOT get liter bikes. Please re-read my original post. My point was (and let me be clear so YOU can understand) is that ALL of the devices mentioned have been developed to help the rider control the bike better -- INCLUDING the A/B/C mode button. If a "nub" is hellbent set on getting a liter bike, why NOT point him to one that will allow him to control the throttle with a switch? You have not presented any argument against the button, only made attacks at me.

Well Iam glad we agree on that certain point of no one yr riders on a liter, But why not just point him in another direction all together and stick with that? Then maybe you'll sway his decision based on your experience? Why not just do that. Seems just as easy and then we wouldnt be having this conversation.

Again these componets are not there to save someone but to propel them to go faster, on a track in the right setting. Not as a platform a novice rider can learn with?


And for the record, I had stated that at this perticular track I raced at you had to steer it in on the front wheel to get a good time. I spent 3 solid years racing their and my experience will always prevail over your belief. And it happens on more of a consistant basis than you think in and around the multiple racing associations throughout the world. 3yrs of watching it on tv isnt going to make someone believe that. Hell you probly wouldnt believe this if I told you, now whould you,....

Cadwell park. BSB!


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Old 02-11-2009, 07:59 PM   #30
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Or this,...
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