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Old 08-10-2007, 06:38 AM   #41
Kenneth_Moore
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Well, hopefully it's never your time to collect. While I don't like giving away my money to a system that I can't affect, I do believe that social programs are necessary to maintain a civilized nation. If you think there are crime problems now, see what happens when there's no security net for people who loose their jobs, homes, family, etc. Is the system abused? Of course. Is the system run effectively and efficiently? Highly unlikely. Can it be better? Absolutely. But it is necessary. And hopefully you'll never need to get your turn to use it.
A willingness to assist others less fortunate than ourselves is a foundation of civilization, and a key differentiator between mankind and the animal kingdom. Oops, sorry. That was political.
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Old 08-10-2007, 06:56 AM   #42
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Well, hopefully it's never your time to collect. While I don't like giving away my money to a system that I can't affect, I do believe that social programs are necessary to maintain a civilized nation. If you think there are crime problems now, see what happens when there's no security net for people who loose their jobs, homes, family, etc. Is the system abused? Of course. Is the system run effectively and efficiently? Highly unlikely. Can it be better? Absolutely. But it is necessary. And hopefully you'll never need to get your turn to use it.
Well, people are always worried sick about those helmetless riders costing them money, while they ignore all the drug addicts, teen pregos, welfare queens, etc. I'm sick of THOSE people. All the Gubment does is figure out ways to give them more money. I just heard the Gubment wants to set up a fund to bail all the people that are getting forclosed because they (of course) bought houses they couldn't afford. I think I need ot quit working and get on the gravy train.
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Old 08-10-2007, 07:14 AM   #43
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How about other forms of social responsibility. So you aren't for Aid to Dependent children, welfare, unemployment paychecks, food stamp, etc.? You are an 'everybody pay their own way' guy? I'm all for it. Those programs cost us a hell of a lot more than injured motorcyclists. I never collected a dime on ANY social program, but I sure as hell paid a hell of a lot of money into them. When is it my time to collect?
The ONLY socialize system I am in favor of is SCHIP. BUT- there needs to be a standard to live by. The Family must make NO more than $40k combined to qualify for Childrens Health Assistance and the system should not be FREE. You should have to pay a minimum premium and Co-pays. When I was poorer (than now) my daughter was in the PeachCare system in GA. I paid $99 a year and $10 Co-pays. I got the service until my income raise back up to a level where I could afford private coverage again and cancelled the State policy. They help long enough for my family to find more income and better (than the state) coverage. No abuse of the system. I asked for nothing free. I paid in, they supplied a service and I dropped out as soon as I could (2 yrs). You don't pay taxes to be taken care of by the Gov't. You pay them to run the Gov't. Do I think food stamps, SCHIP and other welfare programs work? Yes and No- It could work better if we didn't live in a society that abuses the very system. Umemployment, Food Stamps and other programs should have a six month window. After that you should have to re-apply for the aide. If you make it make it harder to stay in the system less people will abuse it.
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Old 08-10-2007, 07:20 AM   #44
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A willingness to assist others less fortunate than ourselves is a foundation of civilization, and a key differentiator between mankind and the animal kingdom. Oops, sorry. That was political.
I need a few bucks for this month's mortgage for the house I couldn't afford, and a few more for the kids I had out of wedlock. Oh yeah, maybe throw in a few more for some drug treatments I need. One other thing. I will need the same from you every month. I'm sure you will be happy to assist. Sometimes even the animals are correct.
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Old 08-10-2007, 08:11 AM   #45
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Kenneth- The term "Less Fortunate" is a joke. There are very few cases were this should apply, if at all. You, me and everyone here make our own way. If a person grows up to be "Less Fortunate" they did not make the choices in life to lead to a life that they are happy with. Is that Less Fortunate or stupidity? I've spend most of my life making very little money because of past mistakes in my steps of life. I'm not Less Fortunate. I was irresponsible (or stupid). Now, I'm 41 and have had ACE for 8yrs. I'm less irresposible now. I made a decision to go back to school (at 30) and get my insurance license. I'm not at the stage where I can say I'm well off, but I'm WAY better off than a decade ago. Less Fortunate wasn't something I depended on and NO ONE else should, for that matter.
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Old 08-10-2007, 08:32 AM   #46
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Kenneth- The term "Less Fortunate" is a joke. There are very few cases were this should apply, if at all. You, me and everyone here make our own way. If a person grows up to be "Less Fortunate" they did not make the choices in life to lead to a life that they are happy with. Is that Less Fortunate or stupidity? I've spend most of my life making very little money because of past mistakes in my steps of life. I'm not Less Fortunate. I was irresponsible (or stupid). Now, I'm 41 and have had ACE for 8yrs. I'm less irresposible now. I made a decision to go back to school (at 30) and get my insurance license. I'm not at the stage where I can say I'm well off, but I'm WAY better off than a decade ago. Less Fortunate wasn't something I depended on and NO ONE else should, for that matter.
No one? Surely you don't mean that not a single person has been put into positions of need by forces outside of there control. What about the people who lost everything in disasters like Katrina? Hard working homeowners who all of a sudden had no home, no job, and a family to take care of. What about the middle class family where mom stays home to take care of the kids (only 2) so has no "career" and her husband all of a sudden dies? Now she has no income and a family to take of, all by herself. I won't even suggest that he died of injuries sustained in a motorcycle accident because he wasn't wearing a helmet...

I realize this isn't what you meant, but my point is that there are people - and probably lots of them - who truly do need assistance for a time, and not because they're lazy or stupid.
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Old 08-10-2007, 09:05 AM   #47
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No one? Surely you don't mean that not a single person has been put into positions of need by forces outside of there control. What about the people who lost everything in disasters like Katrina? Hard working homeowners who all of a sudden had no home, no job, and a family to take care of. What about the middle class family where mom stays home to take care of the kids (only 2) so has no "career" and her husband all of a sudden dies? Now she has no income and a family to take of, all by herself. I won't even suggest that he died of injuries sustained in a motorcycle accident because he wasn't wearing a helmet...

I realize this isn't what you meant, but my point is that there are people - and probably lots of them - who truly do need assistance for a time, and not because they're lazy or stupid.
Natural Disater is not an excuse for "sponging" tax payer money. More waist happend with that (Katrina) than any other disaster (9-11 included) in US history. As for the family referrence: If Dad (or Mom) is a dumb ass, uneducated or will only work a part time job- it is all still no excuse for abuse. You always have a fall-back plan. The system should only be there for temporary help. That's it. It's not my job or anyone elses to make sure tax payer money helps people for extended amounts of time. Katrina victims should have bucked up and started over. They whined instead. If this same Hurricane happened in the '30s people would have picked up and moved on. We (compassionate people) decided to let our gov't throw millions of tax-payer monies at this situation and it was abused. Do Floridians do this- not on that scale (ask Kenneth Moore, he's from there). Step-up, help yourself or loose out. That cut and dry. Sorry this all sounds so mean but after 10yrs (before my insurance career) of being a bail bondsman and bounty hunter (no- it's not like DOG) you take no on compassion for the truly inept. I had to deal with ignorance for too long in that job. We're surrounded by the un/under-educated (thank gov't schools) and they think we owe them- SCREW THEM. Make your own way or get out of the way.
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Old 08-10-2007, 09:14 AM   #48
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The ONLY socialize system I am in favor of is SCHIP. BUT- there needs to be a standard to live by. The Family must make NO more than $40k combined to qualify for Childrens Health Assistance and the system should not be FREE. You should have to pay a minimum premium and Co-pays. When I was poorer (than now) my daughter was in the PeachCare system in GA. I paid $99 a year and $10 Co-pays. I got the service until my income raise back up to a level where I could afford private coverage again and cancelled the State policy. They help long enough for my family to find more income and better (than the state) coverage. No abuse of the system. I asked for nothing free. I paid in, they supplied a service and I dropped out as soon as I could (2 yrs). You don't pay taxes to be taken care of by the Gov't. You pay them to run the Gov't. Do I think food stamps, SCHIP and other welfare programs work? Yes and No- It could work better if we didn't live in a society that abuses the very system. Umemployment, Food Stamps and other programs should have a six month window. After that you should have to re-apply for the aide. If you make it make it harder to stay in the system less people will abuse it.
...the next thing we know you'll be recommending that people who actually work for a living actually deserve a better life than people who won't. Then where would we be? How would that army of otherwise unemployable bureaucrats survive without large masses of losers?
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Old 08-10-2007, 09:26 AM   #49
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I wear helmets. Helmets good. WTF does this have to do with helmets.
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Old 08-10-2007, 09:43 AM   #50
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I need a few bucks for this month's mortgage for the house I couldn't afford, and a few more for the kids I had out of wedlock. Oh yeah, maybe throw in a few more for some drug treatments I need. One other thing. I will need the same from you every month. I'm sure you will be happy to assist. Sometimes even the animals are correct.
I already do, every time I pay taxes. And I don't have a problem with that, because I'd prefer not to live in a nation filled with poverty, disease, and dispair.
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