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Old 05-31-2011, 07:34 PM   #11
acecycleins
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No, the point of the article is to draw a correlation between those starting out and better road skills test before licensing. I believe that there is absolute proof that can be gathered showing that the Euro licensing format has, in fact, made a difference in rider caused fatality or injury. They use bikes as daily transportation on streets that are much more prone to accidents than American streets. I do not believe that we can tier the system like Europe, but I believe that you should be given the "parking lot test" at the same time you take the test for the MP designation. Then you should pay for the "road" test and it actually be a road test when you go back for your M class. You should diary a minimum of 5000 miles on you MP permit or one year w an MP license should pass before you can apply for the M class.
We all have current licenses and would be grand-fathered into this new format. It's about the ones that want to start- no matter the age- being better prepared for the road.
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Old 05-31-2011, 07:39 PM   #12
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Make the cagers do it too and I m in.

Suggesting that moto riders need more testing when car drivers don't, almost makes it look like the accidents are our fault.
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Old 05-31-2011, 08:51 PM   #13
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One of the issues with motorcycle permits is: "It allows you to drive only during daylight hours, under the direct supervision of a licensed motorcycle operator." This is great if you have access to a licensed motorcycle operator. If you don't, you're s.o.l. Then you either stay legal and don't ride, or you don't stay legal and ride by yourself anyway.
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Old 05-31-2011, 09:47 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trenttheuncatchable View Post
One of the issues with motorcycle permits is: "It allows you to drive only during daylight hours, under the direct supervision of a licensed motorcycle operator." This is great if you have access to a licensed motorcycle operator. If you don't, you're s.o.l. Then you either stay legal and don't ride, or you don't stay legal and ride by yourself anyway.
I used to ride all over North San Diego county when I was 13-15' unlicensed, on a dirt bike, on the street.

I picked up some pretty good cornering and cop dodging skills!
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Old 06-01-2011, 08:00 AM   #15
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Guys- are you not following? We send woefully undertrained people into the streets every day. Rider's are the ones at greatest risk. If we identify the fact that those riders have a certain amount of destiny in their own hands by providing them with the tools to be better prepared for the road then wouldn't it be worth it to adjust how we license riders? This licensing procedure would not effect those that are already licensed. Only those about to obtain a license.
The essay only covers mc licensing. Others have picked youth driving and licensing. But in today's world I don't believe that any kid under 17 should be driving. Simply, our roads are not the same as when we were kids and driving is much more risky because of increase congestion.
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Old 06-01-2011, 08:16 AM   #16
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If you want help writing your essay, you're going to have to buy beer.

I'm not saying another word.
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Old 06-01-2011, 08:29 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Buzglyd View Post
If you want help writing your essay, you're going to have to buy beer.

I'm not saying another word.
Ace has been here long enough to know that this wouldn't be easy.
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Old 06-01-2011, 09:22 AM   #18
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A grandfather clause would be a political necessity, but if you're going to make sure people have enough skills to ride safely, they should apply to everyone, even currently licensed riders.

The biggest issue with being young and riding is not knowing that you're mortal and taking stupid risks. Only some of that can be mitigated by more training, and the MSF course already does a pretty good job of pointing them out multiple times.

There are riders without licenses and riders who only have a permit who ride alone, in violation of current law. Rather than more restrictions/testing, it would be better to organize volunteers, maybe as part of existing motorcycle clubs or rider groups, who mentor younger or inexperienced or permit-only riders, giving them another resource to gain experience safely and without high cost. If there were a simple certification process for these volunteers/mentors, that would be make sense, too.
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Old 06-01-2011, 11:08 AM   #19
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Kirk, here's a quote or two for your article:

"When I sold Harley-Davidsons at a large dealership, we had no requirement whatsoever that the buyer even have a motorcycle endorsement, let alone any experience riding. As a result, I personally witnessed two buyers crash their bikes leaving the parking lot, and had more than one bike I sold back in the shop for crash repairs within a month of purchase."

"In Pompano Beach the local mult-line dealership sold a new R1 liter-class sportbike to an inexperienced rider. That rider died on the way home on his new bike, after he lost control at high speed and hit a telephone pole."

Both of those are TRUE FACTS: Fun to KNOW, Fun to TELL.
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Old 06-02-2011, 07:01 AM   #20
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I know Ken. It's not about the sale of the bike or getting the dealer to sell particular bikes on the sales side of the equation. It's about getting people to understand that they should buy a "learner bike" first. In the case of HD it's entirely possible to sell more 883's that are mapped at "learner" 35hp bikes, but it's absolutely possible for them to map the bike for say 40hp. I don't know where the line would be. The argument is: are the standards too easy and where does the conversation begin to put better prepared riders on the road?
Alabama used to automatically give you a MC endorsement when you applied for a C class license at 16yo. BUT if you were 15 and wanted to ride a bike on the road you could get a full M class endorsement if you went to take the test. How asinine is that?
We have to prepare the newest of riders for the road and we do a lousy job no matter what they drive. This argument addresses only the motorcycle aspect of training and licensing. It's the future rider that we must address- not the current ones (as it's too late for us to learn anything- lol).
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Last edited by acecycleins : 06-02-2011 at 07:04 AM.
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