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Old 02-21-2009, 05:26 AM   #11
seruzawa
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Originally Posted by longride View Post
How does that sound? It sounds like a bunch of marble-mouth gibberish to me.

"Signing a bill brought to him by Congress doesn't count."

It doesn't? Says who? You? So you are saying it isn't a new law if he doesn't propose it and I dont' have to follow it? I can go to court and say that the reason they can't put me in jail is because Kenny says Obama never proposed this law, so everything is null and void? Please! Did you go to the Slick Willie school of the definition of the words 'gun law'? A new gun law is a new gun law Kenny. If he signs it, it's HIS Kenny, just like for guys like you the war was BUSH'S war Kenny. Use the same criteria for Obamalama as you did for Bush. If he vetos it, then it is THIERS Kenny. Having others do his dirty work (which is classic for the Chicago crook that he is) doesn't mean it isn't his and that he isn't 100% behind it. I see you are simply backing out of your original statement that there is no time for new gun laws, which is a very smart move on your part. There's going to be plenty of time Kenny, and you know it. Your Slick Willie definition doesn't do much but obscure the fact that Obama will be the most anti-gun President in our history. I'll bet on that one too. Obamalma has supported every single gun law that he has ever had the chance to vote on. He never turned down even one. Should I list them for you? Nah, you would just find another excuse for his actions.
It's called plausible denial. It's hard to believe that Ken thinks he can play such foolish word games.

Another thing we won't be hearing about is Hitlery's statement that we won't let unimportant concerns like human rights interfere with our relationship with China. Ha! Imagine what Kenny would be saying if Bushie had said that. But Obama gets a pass because the Dems are entirely caught up in their cult of personality. They've invested everything in this fraud. Rather than admit a mistake the game will become attacking everyone who hasn't drunk the kool-aid. Maybe they'll start a punishment list like the WH did for that trader who dared to criticize Zero.
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Old 02-21-2009, 05:31 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by longride View Post
How does that sound? It sounds like a bunch of marble-mouth gibberish to me.

"Signing a bill brought to him by Congress doesn't count."

It doesn't? Says who? You? So you are saying it isn't a new law if he doesn't propose it and I dont' have to follow it? I can go to court and say that the reason they can't put me in jail is because Kenny says Obama never proposed this law, so everything is null and void? Please! Did you go to the Slick Willie school of the definition of the words 'gun law'? A new gun law is a new gun law Kenny. If he signs it, it's HIS Kenny, just like for guys like you the war was BUSH'S war Kenny. Use the same criteria for Obamalama as you did for Bush. If he vetos it, then it is THIERS Kenny. Having others do his dirty work (which is classic for the Chicago crook that he is) doesn't mean it isn't his and that he isn't 100% behind it. I see you are simply backing out of your original statement that there is no time for new gun laws, which is a very smart move on your part. There's going to be plenty of time Kenny, and you know it. Your Slick Willie definition doesn't do much but obscure the fact that Obama will be the most anti-gun President in our history. I'll bet on that one too. Obamalma has supported every single gun law that he has ever had the chance to vote on. He never turned down even one. Should I list them for you? Nah, you would just find another excuse for his actions.
Does this mean you don't want to bet?
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Old 02-21-2009, 05:35 AM   #13
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It's called plausible denial. It's hard to believe that Ken thinks he can play such foolish word games.
.
There's no word games here. Look at the original post. I said Obama is going to be too busy with the war and the economy to go out and make a push for anti-gun laws. And the bet is that he won't; not what Congress, who is not Obama, does.

Keep in mind I'm not in favor of gun control laws from Obama or anyone else. Seems to me nobody wants to put their money where their mouth is.
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Old 02-21-2009, 05:59 AM   #14
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There's no word games here. Look at the original post. I said Obama is going to be too busy with the war and the economy to go out and make a push for anti-gun laws. And the bet is that he won't; not what Congress, who is not Obama, does.

Keep in mind I'm not in favor of gun control laws from Obama or anyone else. Seems to me nobody wants to put their money where their mouth is.

More marble-mouthed crap Ken. "Well, he didn't really push for it so it really isn't his fault." BULLSHYT KEN! You are certainly in favor of 'reasonable restirictions' on gun ownership, which means you are in favor of gun control laws. You have stated so in the past. Please make up your mind. I will put my money where my mouth is Ken anytime and anywhere. I just won't put my money where YOUR mouth is, because you want to bullshyt your way through things, and can't even remember that you are for gun control. I said there will be plenty of time for gun laws Ken. There will be new gun laws Ken. Are you betting there won't be or not? If they happen on Obamalama's watch, they are HIS, gun laws Ken. Is that simple enough for you, or are you going to give me more bullshyt? I'll make it simple:

1. I will bet you anything you like that new gun control laws will occur during Obamalama's Presidency. The only ones that don't count will be the ones he Vetos. Simple enough?

2. I will also bet anything you like that Obamalama will create more gun control laws during his Presidency than any of the last 6 Presidents.
Simple enough?


I know you won't take either bet, because there is no bullshyt room in there, and there is about a 99% chance of both occurring. I just want you to admit Obama is not a 2nd Amendment defender and admit he is anti-gun. Admit it or make the bets and prove me wrong. I just put my money where my mouth is and was.
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Old 02-21-2009, 06:13 AM   #15
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Allright, how's this sound:

Obama will not propose, publicize, or otherwise sponsor anti-gun legislation during his Presidency. Signing a bill brought to him by Congress doesn't count.

I'll put up my Shoei helmet. Whatcha got?
To some extent I agree with Kenneth. I think if "they" currently try to pass any anti-gun legislation right now ("now" being within the next 24 month) a massive panic button will be hit.

If the economy is in the crapper, unemployment is rising, and the bailouts are still a work in progress (to put it REALLY politely) I think it would be the worse PR possible and will show a fear within the government that things are going to get worse and they are trying to prevent civil unrest ahead of time.

Now, if the economy smoothes out, unemployment starts to go down and economic growth begins again, that is when I begin to worry about anti-gun legislation. When the government gets everyone fat and happy is when they start to pull shenanigans.

If they do anything now it really won't matter because it will show that everything REALLY IS falling apart and you might as well hide the guns and gather more ammo as the least of your worries will be the ATF.

And I am not a firm believer in just because a Demo is in office means your gun right will deteriorate, because history has shown us that the Repubs have had just as much of a hand in gun legislation as the Demos.

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Old 02-21-2009, 06:36 AM   #16
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1. I will bet you anything you like that new gun control laws will occur during Obamalama's Presidency. The only ones that don't count will be the ones he Vetos. Simple enough?

2. I will also bet anything you like that Obamalama will create more gun control laws during his Presidency than any of the last 6 Presidents.
Simple enough?


I know you won't take either bet, because there is no bullshyt room in there, and there is about a 99% chance of both occurring. I just want you to admit Obama is not a 2nd Amendment defender and admit he is anti-gun. Admit it or make the bets and prove me wrong. I just put my money where my mouth is and was.

Marble-mouthed? What, are you like 90 years old? My great-grandmother used to say that.

Anyway, you're wrong. I'll take bet 2. Obama won't create more gun control laws, I'll even up the bet to include Obama won't create any gun control laws AT ALL. Shoei helmet, what's your bet?

Bet 1 is just plain stupid; any State, city, county, whatever, law on guns? They're passing laws every day; look at Matt's post. No, that's not what the original post was. Once again, for the folks in the back who can't hear so good: OBAMA TOO BUSY WITH OTHER STUFF TO GO START BIG FIGHT OVER GUNS.
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Old 02-21-2009, 07:52 AM   #17
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Marble-mouthed? What, are you like 90 years old? My great-grandmother used to say that.

Anyway, you're wrong. I'll take bet 2. Obama won't create more gun control laws, I'll even up the bet to include Obama won't create any gun control laws AT ALL. Shoei helmet, what's your bet?

Bet 1 is just plain stupid; any State, city, county, whatever, law on guns? They're passing laws every day; look at Matt's post. No, that's not what the original post was. Once again, for the folks in the back who can't hear so good: OBAMA TOO BUSY WITH OTHER STUFF TO GO START BIG FIGHT OVER GUNS.
Of course. He has his lackeys to do his dirty work for him. This way he gets what he wants while pretending that it wasn't his doing. There are always loads of fascists who believe in "reasonable gun restrictions". Turning decent people into victims is a prime activity of the Democrats. More victims = more govt = more power for the control freaks.
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Old 02-21-2009, 08:08 AM   #18
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"Of course. He has his lackeys to do his dirty work for him. This way he gets what he wants while pretending that it wasn't his doing"

I already said that but it was certainly worth repeating. Just look at how his lackeys worked the Blago mess. All behind the scenes. He learned every trick in the book from Daley.
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Old 02-21-2009, 08:12 AM   #19
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Your great grandmother was a smart woman. Obviously, you want to dance around the issue. I guess Obamalama not having time means he's reallly not in favor of gun control. He is, and he will get what he wants on his watch at the local, state, or federal level. I just have one question: Did Bill Clinton lie when he went on national TV to say he never has sex with 'that woman'? The answer will go a long way in showing why you can never pin down a Liberal. You also believe that 'assault weapons' should be banned, correct?
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Old 02-21-2009, 08:16 AM   #20
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Good thing he won't have time. I bet he gets some though.

FACT: Barack Obama voted to allow reckless lawsuits designed to bankrupt the firearms industry.1

FACT: Barack Obama wants to re-impose the failed and discredited Clinton Gun Ban.2

FACT: Barack Obama voted to ban almost all rifle ammunition commonly used for hunting and sport shooting.3

FACT: Barack Obama has endorsed a complete ban on handgun ownership.2

FACT: Barack Obama supports local gun bans in Chicago, Washington, D.C., and other cities.4

FACT: Barack Obama voted to uphold local gun bans and the criminal prosecution of people who use firearms in self-defense.5

FACT: Barack Obama supports gun owner licensing and gun registration.6

FACT: Barack Obama refused to sign a friend-of-the-court Brief in support of individual Second Amendment rights in the Heller case.

FACT: Barack Obama opposes Right to Carry laws.7

FACT: Barack Obama was a member of the Board of Directors of the Joyce Foundation, the leading source of funds for anti-gun organizations and “research.”8

FACT: Barack Obama supported a proposal to ban gun stores within 5 miles of a school or park, which would eliminate almost every gun store in America.9

FACT: Barack Obama voted not to notify gun owners when the state of Illinois did records searches on them.10

FACT: Barack Obama voted against a measure to lower the Firearms Owners Identification card age minimum from 21 to 18, a measure designed to assist young people in the military.11

FACT: Barack Obama favors a ban on standard capacity magazines.12

FACT: Barack Obama supports mandatory micro-stamping.13

FACT: Barack Obama supports mandatory waiting periods.2

FACT: Barack Obama supports repeal of the Tiahrt Amendment, which prohibits information on gun traces collected by the BATFE from being used in reckless lawsuits against firearm dealers and manufacturers.14

FACT: Barack Obama supports one-gun-a-month sales restrictions.9

FACT: Barack Obama supports a ban on inexpensive handguns.9

FACT: Barack Obama supports a ban on the resale of police issued firearms, even if the money is going to police departments for replacement equipment.9

FACT: Barack Obama supports mandatory firearm training requirements for all gun owners and a ban on gun ownership for persons under the age of 21.9


1. United States Senate, S. 397, vote number 219, July 2, 2005. (U.S. Senate: Legislation & Records Home > Votes > Roll Call Vote)

2. Independent Voters of Illinois/Independent Precinct Organization general candidate questionnaire, Sept. 9, 1996. The responses on this survey were described in “Obama had greater role on liberal survey,” Politico, March 31, 20087. (Obama had greater role on liberal survey - Kenneth P. Vogel - Politico.com)

3. United States Senate, S. 397, vote number 217, Kennedy amendment July 2, 2005. (U.S. Senate: Legislation & Records Home > Votes > Roll Call Vote)

4. David Wright, Ursula Fahy and Sunlen Miller, "Obama: 'Common Sense Regulation' On Gun Owners' Rights," ABC News' "Political Radar" Blog, Political Punch, 2/15/08. (Political Radar: Obama: 'Common Sense Regulation' on Gun Owners' Rights)

5. Illinois Senate, March 25, 2004 SB 2165, vote 20.

6. “Fact Check: No News In Obama's Consistent Record.” Obama ’08, December 11, 2007. (Barack Obama and Joe Biden: The Change We Need)

7. “Candidates' gun control positions may figure in Pa. vote,” Pittsburgh Tribune-Review, Wednesday, April 2, 2008, and "Keyes, Obama Are Far Apart On Guns," Chicago Tribune, 9/15/04. (Candidates' gun control positions may figure in Pa. vote - Pittsburgh Tribune-Review)

8. 1998 Joyce Foundation Annual Report, p. 7. (http://www.joycefdn.org/pdf/98_AnnualReport.pdf)

9. “Obama and Gun Control,” The Volokh Conspiracy, taken from the Chicago Defender, Dec. 13, 1999. (The Volokh Conspiracy - Obama and Gun Control:)

10. Illinois Senate, May 5, 2002, SB 1936 Con., vote 26.

11. Illinois Senate, March 25, 2003, SB 2163, vote 18.

12. “Clinton, Edwards, Obama on gun control,” Radio Iowa, Sunday, April 22, 2007. (Radio Iowa: Clinton, Edwards, Obama on gun control)

13. Chicago Tribune blogs, “Barack Obama: NIU Shootings call for action,” February 15, 2008, (The Swamp: Barack Obama: NIU shootings call for action)

14. Barack Obama campaign website: “As president, Barack Obama would repeal the Tiahrt Amendment . . .” (Barack Obama and Joe Biden: The Change We Need | Urban Policy.)
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