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-   -   MotoGP SPOILER! (http://www.motorcycle.com/forum/motogp/3995-motogp-spoiler.html)

pdad13 10-16-2006 06:49 AM

Re: MotoGP SPOILER!
 
I guess you don't watch much MotoGP or motorcycle racing.



Hayden's pass was preceded by Pedrosa repassing after Hayden had taken third position. Being that Pedrosa has a snowball's chance in hell of winning the championship and Hayden was leading, his duty is to back off his team mate, at least until there's a clearer opportunity, team orders or not.



The big difference between Hayden's pass and Pedrosa's attempt is that Hayden didn't crash. Pedrosa was in way too hot with no angle. He botched it but he never should have been that close.



It is already being hailed by most as the one of the dumbest things ever done on a racetrack, possibly the dumbest.

pdad13 10-16-2006 07:12 AM

Re: MotoGP SPOILER!
 
Jiffy, I'm not going to sit here and argue that Hayden's clutch lost him the championship, but it certainly didn't help.



I don't think you understand how a clutch works and how it's used in roadracing. Starting is only the beginning of the problems. A slipping, overheated, glazed-over clutch is equivalent to losing horsepower and having a reliable, functioning one is helpful in controling wheelies and power to the wheel, among other things.



Besides, the only reason that anyone mentions the clutch problem is to counter the argument that "Rossi would have won it anyway if (engine failures, crash with Elias, crash at Assen, etc.)" Well, you could argue that if Hayden's bike had also worked well, he might have wrapped it up by now.



Okay, they've both had some problems (Rossi indeed had more). Fairplay and it is a team sport--the best rider doesn't always win. But this thing with Pedrosa has totally affected the whole process. And it shouldn't have happened.



And so what if Hayden lost his points lead? If Rossi and Hayden came into Valencia tied and Hayden won, he somehow wouldn't deserve it?

RC4ME 10-16-2006 07:30 AM

Re: MotoGP SPOILER!
 
Ill say it again since it got deleted.



Nicky had 51 points and 5 races to bring it, and he sucked the last 5 races.



One race does not make or break a racing season. If Rossi did not DNF 3 times this year Nicky wouldnt even be in the running.



Pederosa is the next Honda contender. Nicky has done chit the last 3 years as the lead driver.



R

ValkBandit 10-16-2006 07:38 AM

Re: MotoGP SPOILER!
 
i was wondering why your post got deleted ... i noticed it too. is this site available to hayden fans only?

Holy_Kaw 10-16-2006 08:10 AM

Re: MotoGP SPOILER!
 
It doesn't appear that your post was deleted, it was simply moderated down. If you change your threshold to -1 and refresh all posts should reappear.

raven_rider 10-16-2006 08:21 AM

Re: MotoGP SPOILER!
 
Anyone who posits a "that was just racing" and/or "everyone races hard" argument is copping out big-time, or just downright dishonest. I think everyone here understands that in racing, motorcycles tearing up and down from speeds approaching 200mph can be an inherently accident-prone situation. Wow..."just racing" and "accidents happen" and "Nicky did it too"... those are serious powers of observation. Let's move on though, beyond a childish and simplistic analysis.



Pedrosa is out of the championship. Pedrosa is Hayden's teammate. Hayden is leading the championship. There is NO OTHER option for Pedrosa but to help his teammate after Hayden passes legitimately...if Hayden can't pass Pedrosa then little Dani can race to his heart's content. But...with two races remaining, Pedrosa firmly ensconced in the clutches of HRC and Hayden passing him on-track...his choice is singular - assist Hayden any way possible. This does not include bombing straight into the turn, over the curb and tucking the front, subsequently t-boning his teammate and (likely) fatally damaging his championship.



Again, to reiterate: Duh. Accidents happen in racing. No big surprise there. Any apologetic for Pedrosa, or the mechanical ills suffered by Rossi leading to 'what could have been' if only Rossi finished every race is asinine at best. Ignorant at worst. This is a team sport that involves machinery that has moving parts. Rossi's moving parts weren't doing so well when Hayden's were. This year, Hayden had a legitimate opportunity to win because of his stellar consistency and pair of race-wins in the first part of the season, where even when the bike wasn't doing so well he soldiered it home for valuable points.



All of the knuckleheaded comments about Hayden's closing abilities, his lack of matched riding talent with Rossi, alleged "luck" this year with competitor's DNF's - mechanical or otherwise - are just that: knuckleheaded. Hayden raced hard, his team raced hard, he got a couple wins, was leading the championship and to not acknowledge that this is a SERIOUSLY CRAP DEAL is infantile. Pedrosa deserves serious sanctions, and as one poster above noted...taken out back for some re-education..



MotoGP this year was fantastic. A strong field with multiple race-winners, any rider's win on a given day. Hayden showing serious consistency with a couple of wins. There were some unfortunate accidents and DNF's that happened early - but most were able to recover admirably. Then you have this yellow-flag nonsense. Then you have a teammate ruining an entire year's work. For anyone to so cavalierly dismiss what happened on Sunday is...well, just dumb.

raven_rider 10-16-2006 08:26 AM

Re: MotoGP SPOILER!
 
Wrong, in this case one race WILL make or break a racing season. Hayden did the heavy-lifting when his competitors were playing patty-cakes with their machines in the garage. All he has to do is defend his points lead. Now he has his opportunity to do that taken away...and by his teammate.



So you say that because Hayden had a couple of less than stellar races (which Rossi also had as you so eloquently put above)...then he doesn't deserve to be given the opportunity to race for the championship...that this one itty-bitty little wee-wee of a mishap shouldn't be given any weight because he, how did you put it..."sucked the last 5 races".



That makes perfect sense.

raven_rider 10-16-2006 08:41 AM

Re: MotoGP SPOILER!
 
Leaving aside the obvious fact that Pedrosa has been racing these tracks for most of his professional career...it makes sense that he could step in and be a contender given his previous success in 125 and 250...and what exactly is the relevance of Hayden's rookie season here?



Hayden was championship leader. So do we say - "Rossi would DEFINITELY be leading IF ONLY!!"?? While at the same time giving Pedrosa a pass and saying "Aw shucks, that's terrible but you know...it IS racing, and racing is tough"?



So which is it? Is racing tough and Rossi has to work harder since he and his team got themselves in a hole early on - and we don't need to have these asinine speculations about what "could have been"? Or does Hayden actually deserve to get a little bit here because he did the heavy-lifting early on while some of his competitors were playing patty-fingers with their bikes in the garage?

Tumper72 10-16-2006 09:03 AM

Re: MotoGP SPOILER!
 
Well said. This was the bonehead of all bonehead moves by Pedrosa knowing what was at stake. Hayden outworked everyone this year and this is his reward. To be taken out of a race by his own, (and I use the term loosely) teamate.



And I don't care what anyone says, Dani WAS trying to pass, didn't have room, and took Nicky out, it was that simple. This was not one of "those racing things", it was just plain STUPID given all that was at stake. And this was not like Rossi being taken out at the start of the year in a first corner entanglement. This was avoidable and should NEVER have happenned. Dani has no excuse.


The_AirHawk 10-16-2006 01:26 PM

Re: MotoGP SPOILER!
 
"Do NOT Eat the Big Pink Urinal Mints"



"Avoid scratching your head with the muzzle of a loaded Revolver"



Or "If you happen to find yourself in a Cult someplace in the middle of French Guiana, DO NOT drink from the Communal Punchbowl............"


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