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Grampi 08-06-2001 04:15 PM

Re: Not impressed?
Harley will finally figure out how to build a reliable engine? Nah.

Grampi 08-06-2001 04:19 PM

Re: No excuse in being so ignorant now because...
That very well could be, because I don't walk into Harley showrooms, unless of course, it's also a Honda showroom.

LimeSqueezr 08-06-2001 04:46 PM

Re: Maybe Kawasaki has the right idea...
In current American culture "cool" and "poser" are virtual synonyms. We're talking about a nation of SUV drivers who never leave pavement.

dlrph 08-06-2001 10:18 PM

Re: VTX is still the biggest and baddest
As a VMax owner and lover, I think you are forgetting the characteristics of a V4 engine with VBoost. I have ridden the VTX and agree that the torque is awesome up to about 4000RPM. Then you have to shift, and not quickly I might add. Then you will have to shift again at 4000RPM to 3rd gear. While you are doing all this work I will be running my VMax to VBoost range(6000-8000RPM) in 1st gear, shifting smoothly and quickly to 2nd,and leaving you far, far behind. I won't have to shift again to maintain my lead. Anyone interested in true real world power needs to experience VBoost-it gives a whole new meaning to the relative concept of power. All the low end grunt of a VTX just makes you have to shift more often as the rev limiter hits-a VMax runs to 10000RPM in every gear and NEVER craps out-an amazing sensation for those that haven't experienced it. And I can run at 60-70MPH thru the mountain curves in Utah without touching any bodywork on my Max. Just try that on a VTX. But hey, to each his own-just enjoy your ride and BE SAFE.

dlrph 08-06-2001 10:37 PM

Re: Open Cruisers Found on Dyno
You must not have learned how to ride your Vmax correctly when you owned it. My Max will ride circles around a VTX on a mountain road, and with a SportMax custom seat I can do 500mi days with no problem. The VTX is so heavy and so porky that it hardly gets out of it's own way(but it does have excellent brakes). I can't understand how true motorcyclists can accept a machine that scrapes body parts in a turn at 30MPH-guess you just have to stick to posture-cruising to your local biker bar. I can accept the VTX for what it is-a look good straight line Sunday ride. That's not enuff for me. But the quality is excellent-Honda has out-Harleyed Harley. But for the ultimate all-around adrenalin rush-straight up and leaned over-nothing beats a VMax. Just my humble opinion though-I could be wrong.

cruiz-euro 08-07-2001 03:09 AM

Re: VTX beaten by V-Rod, dream on
I would like to put my modest European viewpoint to all of you morons who think V-Rod is a VTX beater. Don´t get me wrong, I like the V-Rod and would not mind having one either.

But a VTX beater it is not. When did you see someone cruising at 8000 RPM? Look at the torque at the cruising range 2000 – 4000 RPM, Honda has a 40 - 80 % advantage throughout. At the Very Low End, the sweetest spot, just off idle, the moment when the meaning of life can be momentarily understood, VTX gives more than double.

Even the much deriled old tractors of the H-D make better cruisers. V-Rod is far superior in other aspects and I can commend on the work H-D has done, but hey, we are not talking about cruising then.


LimeSqueezr 08-07-2001 04:17 AM

Motorcycles are not computers...
amortization of tooling & development is the only thing that would help a motorcycle to become cheaper after being in production for several years, and that is a relatively minor slice of the cost pie. Can't remember what the V-max cost in '85 but it may well be cheaper now after adjusting for inflation. Street price may be under $10K if you shop around --I don't know but that's reasonable given the discounts you can get on any Japanese bike that's not in short supply at the moment.

It's amusing to think that when the V-max came out, the IBM PC/AT (an 8MHz 286 with typically 20MB of *hard drive* not RAM) was the state-of-the-art machine and cost several thousand dollars for a complete system. Now they are in landfills. Not so the V-max! I'd say it's a pretty good value.

cruiz-euro 08-07-2001 04:22 AM

The real porker is the V-Rod
Hey Deadeye, what´s this bull about VTX being a porker? Let´s use our gray matter, those of us who have them, and check out the numbers:

1795 cc VTX 705 lb

1130 cc V-Rod 596 lb

Unlike many seem to think, the bike does not go by itself. You have to throw the rider´s weight on top of this. Plus, as you rarely see anyone wearing only speedos cruising with a dry bike, you have to add some for the gear and the liquids also.

The real weight difference - in my case – works out 13% more weight for the VTX. Compare this to 59% of more CC. If you compare a Charger to a Pinto you could call the Charger porky, but you would end up looking like, well, how do I put this politely?


seruzawa 08-07-2001 09:33 AM

Re: Open Cruisers Found on Dyno
This comment keeps popping up and needs to be addressed. So what if Porshe helped HD? The Japanese are noted for importing foreign scientists to do their basic design and research. In fact Japanese industry has frequently complained at the lack of original thinking that comes from the native Japanese workforce.

Most of the engine technology we see today was basically worked out before WWII. Four-valve heads, OHC, etc., etc., all were concieved long before the Japanese started building motorcylcles. While much improvement is made today it more improvement in tweaking decades old ideas to perfection.

Has anyone mentioned that the mono-shock was invented by an American and stolen by Suzuki? The inventor finally ran out of money and could no longer fight the multi-billion dollar giant corporation. So much for cutting edge Japanese technology.

Apparently the Japanese can use foreign engineering with impunity and it's never mentioned. H-D does it once and the bigots start screaming.

cruiz-euro 08-07-2001 09:55 AM

Re: V-Max motor - does not suit a cruiser
It has always escaped me what is in this V-Max => Royal Star evolution that the people don´t understand. Why are the deep thinking folks on this thread bothered about the fact that the HP was cut almost by half?

Cruizer is a cruizer and absolutely has to have the low end torque. If you prefer gunning down the country lane with RPM of >6000 get the V-Max or some sportier. If you prefer to have the movimiento with 2000 RPM you get the Royal (like me). Changing is optional.


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