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Old 03-14-2001, 08:35 AM   #71
bugsplatter
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Default Re: Weekend Madness on Ortega Highway

Not to change the subject, but has anyone else ever wondered what motivates a cop to be a cop? It sure isn't the money!



You might be surprised, a highschool grad. can join the CHP and be pulling in 60 thou a year in 2-3 years. That is more money than I make with my college degree working in a so called high tech job.



As to the character of police officers again you might be surprised how hard it is to become a CHP officer. The psychological investigation and background check is very thorough.



As far as getting jaded, the officer who scrapes us sportbikers off the pavement week after week can hardly be blamed for pulling us over to warn or ticket us when we are speeding. It is the CHPs job to reduce the number of accidents per highway mile travelled in California. If they see a particular group of riders or section of highway involved in a disproportionate amount of accidents it is reasonable that they focus resources in that direction.







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Old 03-14-2001, 08:52 AM   #72
Abe_Froman
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Default The number of apples of either persuasion is irrelevant.

I don't know the specifics of this particular incident. Maybe those guys didn't have plates, and therefore deserved to be pulled over. My best wishes go out to the officer, and his speedy recovery.



Any argument, such as yours, that is based on some arbitrary numerical figure to determine the appropriateness of some particular activity is inherhently flawed and intellectually dishonest. Who decides how many "bad apples" is too many, and therefore bikes are banned from that road? Beyond that, most people arguing for more regulation in a certain area simply don't care what the numbers are anyway. To reference your gun argument, gun control proponets claim that too many kids are killed by guns, and then proceed to vastly overstate and misrepresent that number by including anyone under the age of 20, including gang-bangers and drug dealers. They don't care about the number. They want our guns.



Banning motorcycles from Ortega highway will not have the effect of reducing motorcycle deaths. More likely, it will merely shift the location of some of the fatal accidents. Maybe it will shift some of the knee-dragging traffic closer in to the city, causing more deaths of pedestrians and other motorists, although I will concede that this is mere speculation.



By claiming that you would be willing to give up your guns in order to save one life, you are implicitly saying that you will allow government to take everybody's guns, not just yours. Beyond embodying the epitome of tyranny, this situation would result in a higher incidence of gun deaths. Less guns in the hands of law-abiding people = more deaths at the hands of criminals.



Come out of your utopian fantasy and say hello to reality.
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Old 03-14-2001, 09:57 AM   #73
doclonghair
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Default Re: Weekend Madness on Ortega Highway

stevegrab wrote:

I sincerely hope both of you need the aid of the police some day, and they just spit in your face.





Been there, done that. Of all the things I've heard the Orange County Sherriff's department say to me, my favorite is "I really can't do anything to them until they actually hurt you."



...which is not to say that I feel anything other than disgust and anger at the attack on the CHP officer. But in Orange County, there is a great difference between the CHP and the OCSherriffs.



-doc
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Old 03-14-2001, 10:06 AM   #74
Abe_Froman
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Default You (inadvertently) hit the nail on the head.

If you are breaking laws 9 out of 10 minutes while riding your bike (as I probably do as well) maybe this is a sign that there are too many laws regarding the behavior of vehicles. Maybe, given their lesser mass and lesser threat to the health of other motorists, motorcycles should be somewhat exempt from some traffic laws. It is ridiculous that I, on my 2000 Yamaha R1, must ride under the same constraints as some grizzled frump in his/her mercury medicare sled.



Cops need to spend more of their taxpayer-funded time catching criminals, not extorting money from sportbike riders (and anyone with a sports car for that manner) because their driving habits are in violation of some unreasonably restrictive traffic regulation.
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Old 03-14-2001, 10:18 AM   #75
Abe_Froman
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Default Who's the brain donor?

So it's now OK for cops to act as jack-booted judges and jury?



Yeah, I can see how 2 morons with stolen bikes are far more detrimental to society than a KGB/Gestapo police department. I hope you're the first one they beat down for jaywalking.
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Old 03-14-2001, 11:12 AM   #76
bugsplatter
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Default Re: You (inadvertently) hit the nail on the head.

Ferris,

In my experience as a biker I have been given leeway by the officers I have met. On freeways I seem to be able to speed 10 mph faster than treffic with no CHP intervention. On back roads I have only one ticket for coming out of a corner at about 90 mph. I was written up for 70. SO hey, I'll take it.

In many respects I aggree with your arguement, However, as a group I think we underestimate the risk we pose to other motorists and people on the ground on our blasts down rural roads.
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Old 03-14-2001, 12:34 PM   #77
Abe_Froman
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Default In my experience....

I don't live in California, so I can't speak about the interference (or lack thereof) that police pose to bikers there. I know that they have little to no tolerance for riders here. I was stopped for doing 53 in a 40 on a sunny afternoon on a two lane semi-rural road with zero traffic (sherriff's speed trap.) The local police department set up lidar traps on the road that I live on a couple times a week for two months last summer. I have had cops whip around and follow me for blocks for jetting away from an intersection a little too quick.



I literally ride in fear of the cops a lot of the time here in Minneapolis, not just because of the police themselves, but because if I am prosecuted for excessive speeding, careless, or whatever, my insurance will go through the roof and my riding days will be over. Frankly, I could care less how many tickets I get. It's the insurance that kills me, and the cops know it.
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Old 03-14-2001, 01:54 PM   #78
cburns
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Default Re: Weekend Madness on Ortega Highway

As one who rides Ortega (and has been pulled over)... I know that the people that are riding at 6:45 on a Sunday morning are usually the hard-core knee draggers. It's common knowledge that if you want to go fast at Ortega, you go early. I question how many bike theives are hard-core like that. Who's to say they weren't a couple of hooligan knee-draggers (not all who scrape knees are hooligans, but you know what I mean) weren't our riding their track bikes? Granted it takes a screwed up head to beat up a cop, but I just wanted to throw that out there.



Also, "Ninja-style" sportbikes means two different things to you/me and the average news watcher. Anybody who has a bike with fairings is riding a "ninja-style" bike to anyone who is not a motorcyclist. Besides, they were probably riding GSXRs anyway! That is the bike of choice for hooligans is it not? Just kidding!



I hope they catch these guys soon.
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Old 03-14-2001, 03:27 PM   #79
Bolt-On
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Default Re: Weekend Madness on Ortega Highway

I was very sorry to find out that a CHP officer had been beaten when I was pulled over on Ortega Highway an hour after the incident had taken place. Riding a black "ninja style" motorcycle I knew I was going to be stopped repeatedly on the way home. Every time I was stopped I was courteous to the officer knowing that he was looking for the perpetrators who almost killed a fellow officer.





This incident will make it nearly impossible to enjoy Sunday morning rides on Ortega. The police have been heavily patrolling the area for the last several months and I'm sure it will get worse.

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Old 03-14-2001, 04:31 PM   #80
Wolvie
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Default Re: Weekend Madness on Ortega Highway

Sometimes getting pulled over could be to your benefit...



True story:



I was only pulled over on my bike 2 times. Both times were last year within a week of each other.



The first time I was on the 440 in Staten Island at about 10:30pm on a Saturday night. I'm in the left lane (2 lane highway) with very little traffic. I'm going between 60 & 65 (50 mph zone) and was just beginning to pass 2 cagers traveling about 45 to 50 in the right lane. Knowing how idiots love to just change lanes at will, I'm keeping my eye on the one in the back. Well, he stays in his lane...just as the idiot out front pulls into my lane with no warning (let alone a signal). My front tire was just past his rear bumper when he decided to do this, so I roll off the throttle and start to apply the brakes. Just as this is happening, we pass under an overpass & guess who's camped out on the other side just out of sight...yup, NYPD Highway Patrol. Well, this cager-simpleton nails (and I mean NAILS!) the brake. I've got 2 choices...try to make an emergency brake attempt (never fun!) or cut around. A quick look over my right shoulder shows the other car is close in the right lane, but not quite on me yet. I swerve hard to the right, get the bike on the white line & open up the throttle and pass the idiot in front of me with maybe a foot to spare from the guy in the right lane behind me.



So I'm on my 3rd "Hail Mary" (funny how you remember that stuff at these times...) when I get the full light & siren treatment behind me. Damn! I wasn't doing anything wrong! I was saving my life! This is BULL!



I start to pull over when I see the shoulder is totally covered with sand/gravel/moondust...whatever...just crap. Now I'm thinking, "Great, I avoided that accident just so I could drop my bike on the side of the road in the dark!" I use my left hand (palm down facing the cop) to motion for him to back off my rear tire a bit (since he was about 2" off it) in case I wipe out. To my surprise, I hear over the P.A., "Just stop it in the lane, don't go off the road". Hmm, guess he saw it too.



So I stop, shut down the bike, take off my helmet, goggles & jacket (hint, if it ain't cold, lose the jacket on a stop) & pull out my wallet. The cop walks over & says, "I want you to know, I'm not pulling you over for speeding. I pulled you over for splitting those 2 cars back there in front of me." I nod, say "ah, that's why", and proceed to tell him, in detail, exactly what happened as I hand over my papers. He listens, tells me to wait while he verifies my paperwork, and returns about a minute later. He hands me back my papers, asks a few more questions & says, "OK, be careful" & lets me go.



I'm amazed, those of you in NYC know that a stop by "Highway" pretty much means a definite ticket. The only thing I can figure is that he appreciated the fact I was respectful and didn't try to lie or excuse myself out of it.



Almost a week later, on a Friday night, I'm headed down Hylan Blvd to meet some friends at a movie (& of course, I'm late as usual). Again, I'm maybe 10 mph over the limit. Well, I get the light & siren treatment again. All I can think is, "Great!!! I'm late enough as it is!! Just great!!"



As I pull over, the car doesnÂ’t stop behind me, but stops next to me. I don't even have a chance to dismount when who walks over but the same friggin cop from the week before!! He looks up and down at the bike, then leans over to me and says, "I stopped you last week, right?"



"Uh, yeah."



"You been drinking tonight?"



"No. I don't do that."



"Where you headed?"



"The theater. Meeting some friends."



"Good. Don't go this way. There's a roadblock down about 2 miles. DWI checkpoint. You'll be stuck in traffic forever. Take care"
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