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Old 11-28-2001, 09:48 AM   #181
thomasaanderson
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Default Re: Buell XB9R Firebolt reader feedback

If Buell intended this as a street bike first, then why didn't they give it decent fuel capacity? I'm sorry, but 3.7 gallons of gas just doesn't sound like enough for a 1000cc sport bike. I'm not asking for Iron Butt fuel capacity here, just enough so that I don't have to plan every single route decision and my riding style around fuel availability. I suppose if I lived in Wisconsin or SoCal where there is a gas station every 20 miles I wouldn't be worried about this, but where I ride in the Pacific Northwest many of my favorite routes have stretches of 50-80 miles between gas stations. Unless the Firebolt gets 50mpg under aggressive riding, 3.7 gallons just ain't enough. I'd always be worried about running out of gas. I would have to make extra side trips just to find a gas station, and I'd have to skip other side trips because gas may not be available. And perhaps worst of all, I'd be backing off and coasting at times when I would really like to wick it up and ride more aggressively, simply because I had already ridden 75 hard miles and the next gas station is 40 miles away. Looking for gas stations is NOT my idea of a good time.



I really want to like this bike, and I think I get what it's about, but for me the small fuel capacity would be too much of an inconvenience. Low weight is nice, but it shouldn't be achieved by sacrificing real-world usability.

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Old 11-28-2001, 10:06 AM   #182
CarsSuck
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Default In 99?

Well maybe the pads were glazed. They definitely didn't need bleeding, there was full pressure. Just no feel. Not like the spongy feel when there's a little air, but just a lifeless feel. Well, that's my best guess anyway, I suppose it could've been air. Yes I did forget about the S4, I thought he meant the 900.
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Old 11-28-2001, 10:38 AM   #183
CarsSuck
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Default Re: Buell XB9R Firebolt reader feedback

Erik Buell chose the sportster engine before HD owned Buell. That's what he wanted to do, and I can dig it. Why wish for Buell to use another motor so they can be just like those who already make that motor? That's like wishing Guzzi would make a bike with a TL. I like variety. I love TL1000s, Ducatis, Guzzis, and Buells too. There is nothing in a sportbike that's even the same type of motor as the Buells. Torque peaking at 3500 rpm, this is a long stroke motor. No one makes long stroke motors anymore. The Buell isn't my favorite bike, but I can appreciate it, because the feel of the motor is fun, and it's a lot more fun to me in a sporty chassis than an old traditional frame. If you had to ride at legal speeds, the Buell would feel faster, because you can actually get to the motor's peak at legal speeds. Yes there is a point to it, the motor is not inferior. And for all this talk about Ducati, the Ducati requires valve adjustments every 5000 miles. I've taken trips longer than that, that is ridiculous. The Buell motor has hydraulic lifters, it doesn't require any valve adjustment. Look at the air cooled Ducati motor and the Buell/sportster motor. Both air cooled, both 2 valve per cylinder, both using an ancient form of actuation. But the pushrod actuation of the Buell allows for hydraulic lifters that eliminate the need to adjust valves. The desmo actuation means adjusting valves every 5000 miles! Would someone please tell Ducati we have good valve springs now! Now I like Ducatis. Even better than Buells, because I like a bit revvier motor. But the Buell is a lot of fun, in a way other bikes aren't, because it is different. I don't mean it looks or sounds different, I mean it acts different. Having an old motor design, and a motor that is one of the easiest to work on (with maybe only the Guzzi being easier), and having it get close modern motor performance is pretty cool. It doesn't have to get all the way there, it's a compromise. Also I consider the fact that it doesn't bleed green a plus, not a detriment. Don't tell me how great liquid cooling is as long as there are oil cooled GSXRs out there making as much as a GSXR1000.
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Old 11-28-2001, 10:55 AM   #184
CarsSuck
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Default Forget displacement.

If we're talking streetbikes, the only thing that matters is getting the amount and type of power you want, who cares what volume it takes to do it. If you want to compare just for the hell of it, the Buell motor is air cooled, 2 valves per cylinder. To find a comparison, there's the ducati air cooled 2 valve motor. The Buell motor in the X1 already makes more power, but I'm actually surprised they're not equal. The Buell has 300cc more displacement, but it's a long stroke motor. The Ducati can rev higher, and therefore turn more of it's torque into hp numbers. But the Buell makes almost enough more hp to account for the extra displacement. Not quite, but that's the extra stroke and lower rev ceiling. There's a reason for all of it. Buell is now starting to move towards more square bore/stroke ratio with the new bike, but it's still a long stroke motor. It's a whole different kind of power that some people really like. Some people actually use their bikes you know, and if you need a good city bike a Buell is far and away better than the fours with all the power to high to use all the time. When you're splitting lanes in a hostile environment you need the squirt right there without downshifting, or in the case of a lot of bikes now, slipping the clutch since the power is past city speeds even in first gear. There is a point to this kind of power, and the Buell is the only one that gives it, except for the top power bikes that have enough residual power hanging around the bottom you don't need the top in the city. But it sure isn't an R6, or even the GSXR750. I might suffer for the bike I'd rather have (GSXR750), but if I lived in downtown San Francisco for instance, I'd probably get a Buell, or a motard-type thumper.
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Old 11-28-2001, 11:42 AM   #185
Lateshow
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Default More about the ever boring Nighthawk!!! Yes it is !!!!

The nighthawk is boring, plain, uninspiring etc. I didn't make it so by saying it, it just is. Its about as exciting as a quality blender...just not very fun to ride, compared to what else is out there.



The Buel is cool, I never said it wasn't.



I don't ride an F4 or F3, my last 600 was a 1989 FRZ600. At the time it was a real hoot to ride.



Get a 919, naked Bandit 12 or an SV650.



I like classic bikes from the the sixties and seventies, and I'm not a Buzzword guy.



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Old 11-28-2001, 12:05 PM   #186
Lateshow
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Default Jack and the Raptor

Jack I couldn't agree more with you concerning the Raptor. I can't for the life of me understand why Suzuki failed to bring out an SV1000 "IF" they were blocking Cagiva from bringing thr Raptor to the US.

If not one, why not the other??? Now we got neither...that sucks



I know that as soon as I get a TL1000S converted to SV ergos, there will be a Hawk GT 998 or SV1000 available at my local dealer.



The Buel is cool but it needs a "new" motor to keep up in the marketplace. Like say the VR motor from the V-Rod. Make it good enought to sell em by the gross, and they could afford to put that motor in the "next" Buel.
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Old 11-28-2001, 12:10 PM   #187
Jack_R750
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Default Re: In 99?

Actually, I meant Monster S4, and to add to it, a Cagiva Raptor, which is a better one...

And wheelbase is good for one thing - to give you a U-turn radius.. Even not that. By itself, without rake/trail, it means just pure loss of straight line stability. The bike must be flickable, judging by the engineering (Can't imagine riding one - we don't and won't have them here), and it adds to its definition as a streetfighter - or, if you better put it, a "town racer". Granted. Interesting, how it will compare to the Hornet 900, or even the CBR929RR, which is achieving the flickability with mentioned at least 3" longer wheelbase (even more - I just don't remember the exact number).

By "streetfighter" I don't mean only a stripped and heavily modded race rep, but what you would call "Roadster" or something like that - a "hooligan bike" being another definition.
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Old 11-28-2001, 12:24 PM   #188
Jack_R750
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Default Re: Price is perfectly acceptable

I happen to disagree with you - I think faired Monster S4, Cagiva Raptor (or better V-Raptor) and the likes are more likely the competitors of this thing than the bikes you mentioned. Ah, you can throw in the old Suzuki TL1000S, perhaps, with its rear shock changed and a damper (I wanted to add an SV650, but it's smaller and hence can't be the same class, lacking power in comparison). In this genre, it's heavily overpriced, in my opinion, loosing power and torque to any of the aforementioned, and giving no exceptional feel with all the tricky technology..

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Old 11-28-2001, 12:38 PM   #189
Jack_R750
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Default Re: Forget displacement.

1) About Ducati air cooled 2 valve - there is some new version of it, I don't remember where and in what bike, worth checking out if you really want, since the numbers it produces aren't lagging behind the Buell. 2) I understand the power needs for the city - I happen to live in one big traffic jam , and I know what it is to pull the clutch too many times. But I figure out you didn't put attention to my words - I DON'T think this should be compared to the big inline4s, but to its rivals - Monster/Raptor/TL1000S, each overpowering it by torque AND horsepower. The thing is that what we rattle about here is meaningless, since they probably deliver the power differently. But, my point is that another design would allow the same power delivery character with added power/torque, which could be more fun. And maybe lessen the problems/recalls..
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Old 11-28-2001, 12:48 PM   #190
Jack_R750
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Default Re: Buell XB9R Firebolt reader feedback

Well, for one point I agree - variety is good. And I didn't want to spoil Buell's image by criticizing it - just my reason not to try and get my hands on one (which is SO difficult, importing it from overseas, you wouldn't believe). And, I happened to ride one of the mentioned oil-cooled improved GSX-Rs.. Though it couldn't quite make as much power as GSX-R1000, it was stunning some old CBR900s..

And I loved that instant reaction of the motor, pulling from as low as 3000 RPM.. They don't do it anymore. But new CBR900s do )))
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