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Old 10-23-2002, 05:06 PM   #61
desertbilly
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Default On Sale Next Summer

It looks real nice and I wish Victory luck, but at $15k, I suspect they'll sell about 5. Buyers who want HD's won't consider them, and buyers who aren't set on HD's will see them as costing $2k to $7k above the (mostly Japanese) alternatives. I think if the Vegas were priced at $8,995, they could sell a fair number of them.



Manufacturers can't come into a market place and assume they have top rank status, just because they want it. They're going to have to pay their dues, and work their way up the prestige/pricing ladder. All the talk about buying American didn't help EH, Titan, Indian, etc. It's not really about buying American -- it's about buying HD.



Peter Drucker's pricing theory held that most companies came up with a new product, and added all their costs and overhead, tacked on a profit, and that was the price. Then they wondered why the product didn't sell. He said companies should come up with a product, talk to their customers to find out what they would pay for the product, and then figure out a way to manufacture and sell the product for the price the customers would pay. That's the way to be in business and make a profit.
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Old 10-23-2002, 06:58 PM   #62
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Default Economic Realities 101 - Made in the U.S.A.

I agree with you that any new entity has to earn its way to success and Victory IS paying its dues. Victory's management knows price volume relationship economics but has positioned itself as a premium American brand priced below H-D. The intention was never to compete price-wise with Japanese makes because they can't. With an MSRP of $14,999 Victory isn't making any money on the Vegas. The dealer wholesale price is probably $12,500. If you sum the fixed costs with the variable cost components, amortize R&D, add training, support, management salaries, benefits, warranty reserve, etc. -- what could be left. The business model requires a minimum break-even volume before any profits can be realized. Unfortunately, manufacturing goods in the U.S.A. also bears a high cost burden. Victory would certainly sell more bikes if they lowered the price, but they can't afford to. Its up to the designers and engineers to create a high value product and the marketing folks to convince you its worth the money. In the case of the Vegas, hopefully it is.
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Old 10-24-2002, 12:01 AM   #63
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Default Re: On Sale Next Summer

I agree. If they ever want to be anything more than a niche manufacturer, they will have to sacrifice a lot of profit and try to move as many out the door as possible. The only way to enter the mainstream bike market is to get lots of bikes on the streets. As long as the average Joe Sixpack has never heard of them or seen one of their bikes, they are stillborn.



At $15,000, they seem to be targeting only a tiny sliver of the market – Cruiser riders who don’t mind spending a few thousand extra to buy American, but don’t like Harley or just like to be different.
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Old 10-24-2002, 06:52 AM   #64
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Default Re: First Ride: Victory Vegas

Did you ride a Warrior yet? I rode one at Sturgis and I thought the ergonomics were fine. BTW, I'm 6'0", about 220 lbs, 34" inseam. Even if they aren't perfect for you, I would think it would be esaier to buy a new seat or something like that for the Warrior than take a chance on an unproven brand like Victory.

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Old 10-24-2002, 01:42 PM   #65
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Default Re: First Ride: Victory Vegas

I had polaris send me a brochure and it states the stock freedom motor is about 80 HP and shows dyno charts.Thats b@lls especially compared with HD @ around 60.
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Old 10-24-2002, 01:56 PM   #66
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Default Re: First Ride: Victory Vegas

The price is a bit high but if it is reliable and comes with so much more power and there is little to customize on this bike....(just look at the turn signals and tail light). If a HD softail standard is $17,000 (which is the price quoted at the dealer to me about 2 weeks ago)I would certainly buy the vegas and put my money in a company that is hopefully trying to price thier bikes fairly. This whole mystique thing is getting ridiculously expensive.
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Old 10-24-2002, 01:59 PM   #67
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Default Re: First Ride: Victory Vegas

I would like to see a solid wheel or somthing in the rear.
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Old 10-24-2002, 05:47 PM   #68
leach7
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Default Re: First Ride: Victory Vegas

The Vegas looks awesome, but is that a backrest or a backseat on the back of that thing? I might be interested in the Vegas, but if that is a seat back there, I see myself stopping about every 10 feet for my wife. Any word on a better seat?
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Old 10-25-2002, 08:15 AM   #69
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Default Re: Performs appropriately for a cruiser.

I'm glad to hear that you are optimistic about continuing to do business with Victory, because I've read of many dealers who don't, and other dealers who don't give a "darn" about learning how to service them.
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Old 10-25-2002, 08:36 AM   #70
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Default Re: First Ride: Victory Vegas

I've loved the look since I first saw a picture of a pre-production model. I want one big-time. I understand you reason for not mentioning the Ness's, but come on, they are a big name with big time credibility, and they're involvement is newsworthy.
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