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Old 08-19-2002, 05:33 PM   #21
johnnyb
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Default Re: John Burns: an exercise in contradiction

Where do you get the idea I embrace those laws? Just the opposite, but I understand the reason they exist is BECAUSE of highly visible, highly abrasive groups like ABATE.



I also agree that a lot, if not the bulk, of our freedoms are gone. To pick out "having to wear a helmet" is like complaining about one pebble in a boulder field. Why don't the AMA and ABATE complain about something that would actually help us all, like getting cell phones banned while driving? Whatever happened with the New England Journal of Medicine's report a few years ago which said that was just as dangerous as drunk driving?
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Old 08-19-2002, 05:39 PM   #22
johnnyb
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Default Re: ''Helmet or Thick Skull'' Reader Feedback

The old slippery slope eh? Look around, we're already at the bottom of the gulch. Do you think we'd be more free riding helmetless? When we already have to keep it below 65mph, with functional head and taillights, turn signals, blinkers, with current registration, insurance, with less than 0.8 BAC, what am I leaving out? Helmet laws are the red cape for the ABATE bulls and other hoofed mammals to stupidly charge.
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Old 08-19-2002, 05:40 PM   #23
danch
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Default Re: Regulations are good for you

That's rotting pigs intestines. Pig's intestines are called sausage casings in polite company - really it's the rot that's problematic, not the guts
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Old 08-19-2002, 05:43 PM   #24
johnnyb
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Default Re: ''Helmet or Thick Skull'' Reader Feedback

Car drivers don't have to wear helmets because there are like 200 bazillion of them in the U.S., and about what? 0.5% that many motorcyclists you simp. They do have to wear seatbelts (and there was hellacious caterwauling over that).



The majority rules. If you are a loud, obnoxious ant in a room full of cows, expect to get stomped on.
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Old 08-19-2002, 05:46 PM   #25
danch
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Default Re: Democrats and Socialists......

<blockquote>when does all the "You are too stupid to make your own choices, so Daddy Government is going to do so" stop?</blockquote>



Maybe when people stop being too stupid to make their own choices. Really, I think that there should be one simple helmet law: If you mess your cranium in a crash while not wearing a helmet, you're paying your own bills, you're off any welfare lists, and you and all of your survivors get the ole 'snip snip'. We really can't have those genes in the human pool. My real problem with regulating personal safety is that it's slowing the evolution of the human species - people who don't wear seatbelts should also be encouraged to take themselves out, not with a law demanding that they behave as though they deserve to breed, but with a law ensuring that if they don't deserve to survive, they won't.
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Old 08-19-2002, 05:46 PM   #26
johnnyb
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Default Re: Democrats and Socialists......

o shut up man...
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Old 08-19-2002, 05:48 PM   #27
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Default Re: ''Helmet or Thick Skull'' Reader Feedback

What a beautiful point. I want to expand on it and address some common helmet law supporter hyperbole: All of the "shut up and wear your helmet" types constantly invoke the supposed cost to society of disabled motorcyclists.


So what is the cost to society? Enumerate it. If you don't have a reasonably supportable dollar figure, then your argument is pretty weak.
Can you just add up the lifetime social security benefits for all the helmetless Americans disabled in motorcycle accidents? The answer is no for several reasons:

[*]You can't assume that every helmetless disabled motorcycle accident victim would have been saved by a helmet. This is easy to prove: Many helmeted riders are disabled in motorcycle accidents.[*]You can't assume that a helmeted rider, once saved from motorcycle accident induced disability, won't become disabled shortly thereafter for some other reason. This too, is easy to prove: Many people become disabled, sometimes through their own stupid, yet non-motorcycle related actions. Whether those people wore a helmet on their bikes or not is a moot point. So, you can't say for certain that a helmetless rider "never would have become disabled" had he worn a helmet. He may just have found some other way to become disabled.


Perhaps it would help us all to remember this simple truth: No matter who you are, or what you choose to do, someone else thinks you are an idiot.


So the guy in the beanie helmet thinks the helmetless rider is an idiot. You, in your Arai, think the beanie wearer is an idiot. Your father-in-law, with the SUV, thinks you're an idiot. There's no end to it. We can't idiot-proof the nation, because we're all idiots. So let idiots be idiots... with any luck, the people that you think are idiots will do themselves in before you do yourself in. Give them that freedom, and you're more likely to retain the same freedom for yourself.
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Old 08-19-2002, 05:48 PM   #28
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Default Full face helmet, shorts, and a tank top

Can someone explain to me why it makes sense to anyone to _not_ have a lethal head injury when your flesh is being abraded from your body. I see so many people with a full face helmet and completely inadequate gear otherwise. Why?
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Old 08-19-2002, 05:48 PM   #29
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Default Re: ''Helmet or Thick Skull'' Reader Feedback

John,



You should be thankful that you can't hop on your bike and run to the corner store without a helmet. According to the Motorcycle Safety Foundation, most accidents occur within five miles of your home. Many times it isn't on the longer rides. The fact that you throw on a DOT half-helmet really doesn't help much except that you won't get a ticket. I just finished the MSF class and one of the requirements is a DOT helmet. The first night we had class time and the next day we were to come dressed properly and with a helmet to begin the training on the bikes. The last thing we were told is to not show up with a beanie or half helmet. When questioned about this the instructors said, "They don't do an adequate job of protecting your face, jaw, neck, and head." This is even though they are DOT approved. Throw away the beanie, put on the full face, which logically provides the best protection, and then go to the store. By the way, as a side note, you might think about quitting smoking too. My Dad, who smoked for 45 years, had a tumor removed from his lung 7 years ago and just had a malignant lump removed from his voice box. It will catch up with you, just like wearing a half helmet.
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Old 08-19-2002, 05:49 PM   #30
johnnyb
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Default Re: Democrats and Socialists......

Sorry. Let's go the opposite direction with your crusty ass slippery slope solipsism. If all 50 states abandon helmet laws, and thousands more idiots crash their brains out, wouldn't it make it way easier to outlaw motorcycles entirely?
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