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Grappelli 02-03-2002 09:09 PM

Re: 954 vs R1 Reader Feedback
That's all very well, but none of these bikes would exist "without getting obsessive-compulsive about immaterial details".

So my question becomes, do you like Harley Davidsons? Because, they're "fast enough" for road use. In fact they're faster than most cars.

Now I have nothing against Hogs, but I'm really glad bike like these have pushed up the bar for all bikes - even the VFR's being decried earlier on in the feedback.

Abe_Froman 02-04-2002 04:35 AM

Has the world gone crazy?
Frankly, I find the power of my '00 R1 to be just about right. I can putz along just as slow as your VFR goes, yet when I decide to pick up the pace, I don't need to shift down 3 gears to get out of my own way. The huge torque is at least as important as, and probably much more so, than top-end power, which only gets used once in a while.

This article also comments on the previous R1's weight, which seems to have become abundant all of a sudden. Let's not get carried away here, after all, you would have to add 80 pounds or so to equal the VFR.

Yep, less power, much less torque, and a lot more weight----that's what we need!!

Abe_Froman 02-04-2002 04:45 AM

My sentiments exactly....
Far from being the case, the modern motorcycle magazine contributor is a wonderfully talented and astute observer of the nuances of both past-day and modern motorcycles. Their expertise in articulating their experiences on the track and on the streets, as well as less tangible assets such as appearance and reliability are both entertaining and invaluable to less knowledgable folk such as myself. Furthermore, they provide hours of entertainment with their humorous and informative journalism.

By the way, how's that whole "guest tester" thing coming along for the open-bike shootout?

BadF4 02-04-2002 07:31 AM

Re: Wheelies are no measure of power
Not that I don't agree to some extent with the statement above, but obviously you have never ridden a 929, an R1, or a 954. Even the 929 is an exercise in wheelie control in the first two gears when launching hard, and I would know, since I have one. As for everyone relaxing, I agree. The people that ***** about not getting an increase of 15 horsepower every year are usually the people who could never begin to push the limits of todays 600's. Be happy we have such awesome machines designed for our enjoyment!

jmeyn 02-04-2002 09:24 AM

Re: Wheelies are no measure of power
You can wheelie a bicycle if you sit on the rear bumper. The kids on 70cc motorbikes do laps of the basketball court across the street with their wheels in the air half the time. All I mean is that you can't accelerate a bike unless the weight on the front wheel is less than zero.

jmeyn 02-04-2002 09:30 AM

Re: 954 vs R1 Reader Feedback
Whoops. I wonder why they even mentioned it!

Abe_Froman 02-04-2002 09:33 AM

In spite of the small forward change in rider position, the 954 would still wheelie nearly as easily as the R1 if the power was similar. The wheelbase measurements are identical. The 954 would start lifting the front wheel instead of spinning the rear tire. It's simple physics.

stormcloud 02-04-2002 11:34 AM

Re: 954 vs R1 Reader Feedback
I'm not against refinement and tech advances at all, nor these genre of bikes. I like these bikes, just like I like 600's, sports tourers etc.

I'm not against powerful or fast bikes - they're a blast to ride.

Yes passion and 'obsession'/drive lead to improvements (+ profits..) - that wasnt the issue of my comment.

The 'obsessive' comment was related to a disproportionate focus in posts about a couple of bhp difference - besides, Honda could build a 1000cc RR if they chose to I think.

I just dont know whats gained by getting all excited and upset about one bike being a couple of bhp down on another - have a loook at some of the posts above that slam a bike for being 'slow'

If unaware of which of these we were test riding, would our preference be just because we could detect a fractionaly harder acceleration on one over another? Think about how many aspects of a bike make up the total experience of a ride. Keep in mind these are already very very powerful bikes - e.g. the difference b/w 135 and 140 HP is only a couple of percent, and is only a PEAK power figure - at what revs do you have to be to experience it. The character of delivery of the power is going to be much more obvious to a rider. A 750 4-cyl makes more power than a 1000cc twin yet that alone doesn't necessarily make it more or less desirable.

In answer to your question, I dont mind Harleys but I wouldnt buy one for sport riding if thats what I wanted to do most , any more than I'd use a GSXR to go dirt riding.

Happy riding!

boxjoint 02-05-2002 02:38 AM

I bet that's why the performance standards and trailies are huge sellers over there.

Cyberj10 02-05-2002 06:11 AM

Re: 954 vs R1 Reader Feedback
I heard Troy Bayliss rides an R1 on the street among other things (Lamborghini).

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