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Old 06-11-2007, 08:55 AM   #41
Buzglyd
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Default Re: A premium to buy American?

Back when the tires were skinny and the racers were fat!
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Old 06-11-2007, 08:55 AM   #42
HelterSkelter
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Default Thread Jack alert!!

*Sigh*





Porsche did *NOT* design the VR-1000 engine.



Can we please put that urban legend to rest now?



*Thread jack over*



MotoGP and Formula 1 are uninteresting to Americans because:



a. They are percieved as being run by snobby Europeans.

b. Americans aren't interested in what turns the rest of the world on.

c. It ain't NASCAR is it? Them boys kin sure drive a car.



As for races here, for godsakes the WORLD MotoGP race here is organised by a California amateur racing club, no wonder it's not on anybodies radar.
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Old 06-11-2007, 08:58 AM   #43
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Default Re: So

Obviously they would still produce their bread and butter, but...



It will be a money loser for at least 5 to 10 years of development plus the first 5 to 6 years once the model is released. I feel HD could pull it off and be profitable, it's what they do. But as an investor I wouldn't wait the 10 to 16 years of lose revenue and speculation which, I would think, would cause the stock value to fluctuate quite a bit. Especially if they state that this will be the future of HD.



And if you think 10-16 years is incorrect, take a look at the V-Rod timeline.



And cruisers have a far longer life span in the market than a lot of people think.

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Old 06-11-2007, 08:58 AM   #44
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Default Re: Why not here?

No it's: "We're not a Third World Country, yet."
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Old 06-11-2007, 09:05 AM   #45
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Default Re: A premium to buy American?

Harley already builds a sportbike. The type of roads and terrain here are perfect for bikes like the Buell Firebolt and Lightening. We don't really have the long highspeed sweepers that you can use R1 type power on. Most of the really fun roads here are similar to The Dragon except they go for way more than 11 miles, in that kind of crank and bank riding bikes like the Buell and Ducati's and Honda VTR 1000 are best. 160 hp at 15k rpm does you no good because you'll rarely get up that high, what works here is lean angles and torque.



A good rider on a Buell can run away and hide from a lot "faster" bike in that kind of tight turn short straight tight turn in the opposite direction short uphill tight turn etc. Of course trying to convince the great unwashed that a 100 hp bike can beat a 160 hp bike is a waste of breath and Harley does a pretty shameful job of promoting Buell as well.



America does build a competitive sportbike, they just don't want to tell anyone about it.
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Old 06-11-2007, 09:06 AM   #46
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Default Re: Why not here?

I always thought that the same people who would buy a Triumph, BMW or Ducati would buy a GT type bike from Harley. Buell was on the right track with the thunderbolts, if they had continued to develop that idea I think this conversation would be different.

I think it boils down to one unpopular statement,

The current trend and reason for some of Harleys success is that the majority of bikers being brought into the sport are weekend warrior types who want to look cool on Saturday cruising around and those people donÂ’t want a sportbike.

I am not talking about the people who you see on all, and I mean all, makes of bikes on "Ride to work day" or on a cross country tour with a dirty Electroglide or ZX11. The number of Americans out here that really ride and "live it and mean it" cannot support an American manufacture building a sport or GT bike. It would need to sell equally well all over the world and on that kind of risk is not something HD wants to risk or any other manufacture could attempt. Foreigners will not buy an inferior product for more money without the image. The Japanese love Harleys for what it represents as an US icon and thatÂ’s it. Same with the Euros. Harley has almost marketed itself into a niche that it will never get out of.

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Old 06-11-2007, 09:10 AM   #47
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Default Re: So

I've been hearing that "HD is gonna lose because of the old pushrod tech" since the 60's. Why then did Yamaha's line of big cruisers go back to pushrods and air-cooling?



I read the websites and all the 'experts' say that young people only buy 'hi-tech' sportbikes. Then I go out and look at reality and see plenty of young guys looking at the Japanese cruisers at the local shops and drooling over Harleys. This idea that when the baby boomers give up their armchaps then HD will collapse is probably a loser. Sure, the used market might become more reasonably priced, but remember that HD weathered the absolute worst economic times of the later 20th Century... the 70's, the Carter Recession and AMF ownership. Now, I know that the know-nothings are going to whine about how Bush has the worst economy, but they obviously didn't live through Johnson's, Nixon's and especially Carter's incompetence. If HD could survive that then I think they'll survive the loss of the boomers.



The dying off of the boomers is going to depress every area of economic activity, not just bikes. If the resulting recession isn't handled properly the whining GenXers are gonna be nostalgic for Bush sometime down the line.



Personally, I'd looove the cruiser market to collapse. Then I could pick up a project Harley for cheap. But, I don't think it's gonna happen any time soon.
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Old 06-11-2007, 09:11 AM   #48
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Default Re: A premium to buy American?

Who you callin' old ya little sum'bytch? A pretty good percentage of those guys are riding BMW, Harley's and Triumph now. Then you get the odd weirdo with the Suzuki Bandit or ZRX, both capable of getting out of their own way without too much trouble.
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Old 06-11-2007, 09:12 AM   #49
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Default Re: Why not here?

I did not mean anything ill towards alabama. I am from Georgia and was raised knowing full well that it is South Carolina that sucks. Just kidding, just kidding, sort of.
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Old 06-11-2007, 09:14 AM   #50
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Default Tsk tsk, dumb union dweeb

Sorry but the specsheets just don't support your opinion.



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