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Old 05-04-2006, 07:50 AM   #21
skeepee
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Default Re: Indians, Harleys, Triumphs, and Fake Rolexes

It'll be a long time, if ever, that Indian is properly revived. Seemingly every market has a different claimant to the name.



The only neo-Indian effort I've thought interesting is from http://www.indian-uk.com. Not in Indian's original spirit of performance and technology, but at least an earnest effort to do the name justice.



Given Indian's fierce rivalry with HD, I can't think of a greater insult to the marque than to churn out a bunch of pretenders powered by Harley-clone motors.
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Old 05-04-2006, 07:54 AM   #22
ncelik
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Default Re: Indians, Harleys, Triumphs, and Fake Rolexes

Well said. Alas, you WILL see Stelician review the Indian name, and many buying into it.



Forget for a moment the HD sticker, but the Aeromacchi's look neat as an collectors piece; the bastard history is probably making them worth more in the long run:



http://members.tripod.com/ItalianHD/...amantex90c.jpg



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Old 05-04-2006, 08:49 AM   #23
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Default Re: Indians, Harleys, Triumphs, and Fake Rolexes

Your basic line of reasoning is sound and I agree with it. I just think the Aermacchi-HD example is not well chosen.



You're line of reasoning starts to slip. Your point(s) seemed to be that HD-badged Aermacchis failed because the bikes were no good and they had no history and that people were expected to buy them just for the name on the tank. As pplasm points out, Aermacchi did have some racing heritage and they were making machines that were competitive and attractive in their day and that people should have been willing to buy them on their own merits. What happened is that relatively few were willing to buy them as HDs. The dynamic at work was and is that most people who want an HD have a fairly closed mind as to what an HD is and are fairly unwilling to look at anything outside of that small box. The criticisms of the V-Rod by many of the HD faithful are proof of this mindset. I suggest that it was the limited desire of the HD market to diversify its tastes that led to the HD-Aermacchis relative lack of sales success and nothing inherit in the bikes themselves. Aermachis were not cheap imitations with a re-badging. They were respctable motorcycles for their intended use, but the HD crowd had a limited appetite for anything beyond the existing catalog of Harleys.



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Old 05-04-2006, 09:41 AM   #24
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Default Re: Indians, Harleys, Triumphs, and Fake Rolexes

I'd also add to your comment that the non H-D buyer of the time wasn't willing to look outside their small box either. They also had a pre-conceived notion about what a H-D was, and what it wasn't. If the bikes were that good, had such a great racing heritage, and were as 'competitive and attractive' as you say they were, then why didn't others outside the H-D family buy them? Where were the 'free thinking' Kaw/Hon/Suz/ Yam buyers? The non Harley buyers should have sought them out in droves, if all you claim was true, but alas, it's the H-D buyer that gets hung with the 'smallminded/simpleton' tag, and blamed for the failure of the re-badged Harleys, which were never designed to appeal to them in the first place. The V-Rod was also designed to sell to the non-traditional Harley buyer. If it success or failure will depend on the buyers that are currently outside the traditional Harley market. That's what it was designed to attract.
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Old 05-04-2006, 10:58 AM   #25
dmorga1
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Default Rolex WHAT?!!

Are you kidding me? Just because Rolexes are made with tender loving care does NOT mean they perform well. I own a Submariner. My friends own DateJusts, Submariners, Daytonas, GMT Masters, and so on. They are all famously inaccurate. You want accurate? Buy a Timex digital. Perfect time, every time. Rolexes are totally about aesthetic value. I love mine, it's stainless steel, it's the only piece of jewelry I wear, and it was a graduation gift to myself back in undergrad. It's a nice reminder of good work done. But accurate? Oh, hell, no. Most come VERY fast. Mine used to gain 5 minutes a month or more--it's down to 3 or so. So, in short, don't confuse tender loving care, aesthetics, and performance. They ain't the same thing!



Respectfully,



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Old 05-04-2006, 11:58 AM   #26
electraglider_1997
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Default Re: Rolex WHAT?!!

Oh, the humanity!
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Old 05-04-2006, 01:14 PM   #27
jstern02
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Default Re: Indians, Harleys, Triumphs, and Fake Rolexes

Hey, isn't that V8 Norton supposed to be coming out soon?
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Old 05-04-2006, 01:19 PM   #28
BMW4VWW
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Default Re: Indians, Harleys, Triumphs, and Fake Rolexes

Apparently to be original they need to build a V-7.
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Old 05-04-2006, 02:31 PM   #29
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Default Re: Indians, Harleys, Triumphs, and Fake Rolexes

I don't see why Rolex should be admired for selling overpriced watches that are functionally no better than the Timex throwaways I wear skin diving. And Harley gets no special credit in my mind for copying itself (and Indian) for 60yrs.



Somebody pointed out that almost all engine configurations have been built, so it seems impossible for Indian to do anything but copy. Let me point out this isn't so; and in fact there is an engine that not only hasn't been built for motorcycles but which fits perfectly in the American tradition. Build a V-twin diesel. It's not only got USA written all over it - it's got super gas mileage too. Put it in a good sporting chassis with 100hp and I'll buy one.
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Old 05-04-2006, 02:46 PM   #30
sqidbait
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Default Re: Rolex WHAT?!!

Yup, that's the "problem" with mechanical watches: if keeping accurate time is important, a digital watch is a much better buy from both a performance and cost standpoint.



Now, for some people, there is a certain aura associated with a good automatic. I can't claim to own a Rolex, but I rather like the Invicta 8926 that's currently on my wrist.



And I am debating the purchase of a MarcelloC.







-- Michael

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