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Old 08-06-2005, 08:59 AM   #11
seruzawa
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Default Re: Production Of Fuel Cell Motorcycles Begins

Put cards in the spokes!
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Old 08-06-2005, 10:36 AM   #12
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Default Re: Production Of Fuel Cell Motorcycles Begins

Advantages of fuel-cell bikes are similar to those of electric bikes, except the fuel cell is perhaps a more promising source of electrical energy.



I might enjoy an electric/fuel-cell bike for cruising mountain roads and back roads. It would be like riding a very fast bicycle - silent, smooth, peaceful. I'm always surprised by the silence when I stop at a vista and shut down the motor. What if I could have that silence every time I coast to a stop? Only the crunch of gravel as I cruise along. Very attractive.



Of course I can get that on a mountain-bike, but at the expense of short range and great physical exertion.



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Old 08-06-2005, 10:38 AM   #13
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Default Re: Production Of Fuel Cell Motorcycles Begins

To be fair this thing is about emissions, not efficency. They are not the same thing.



Of course while the little cycle emits water the energy used to the seperate those cute little hydrgen atoms requires making CO2.



There is no alternative to oil, in any thermodynamic sense, save nuclear power. (There isn't enough uranium to replace more than a fraction of the worlds electricity needs by the way) The energy is already cooked into oil. Every other conceiveable alternative requires a significant amount of energy added to make useable.



Think about this. It takes more energy (calories) to produce process and store food crops than they yield, when used by the human body. I know it sounds crazy but agriculture is also a thermocynamic loser.

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Old 08-06-2005, 04:21 PM   #14
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Default Re: Production Of Fuel Cell Motorcycles Begins

Man this thing looks like a funky mountain bike. I don't know about you guys, but I know of a much nicer env that is faster too! Check it out: http://www.vectrixusa.com/index3.html
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Old 08-06-2005, 05:35 PM   #15
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Default Biodiesel production is a winner not a loser (facts and data not opinions)

"According to a study written by Drs. Van Dyne and Raymer for the Tennessee Valley Authority, the average US farm consumes fuel at the rate of 82 litres per hectare (8.75 US gallons per acre) of land to produce one crop. However, average crops of rapeseed produce oil at an average rate of 1,029 L/ha (110 US gal/acre), and high-yield rapeseed fields produce about 1,356 L/ha (145 US gal/acre). The ratio of input to output in these cases is roughly 1:12.5 and 1:16.5."





More studies from the U.K this time

say Net energy from rapeseed produced biodiesel is 25157 MJ/ha



Give me facts and data next time not opinons out of your arse...
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Old 08-06-2005, 05:40 PM   #16
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Default What is Biodiesel's Energy Balance?

Independent third-party, peer-reviewed studies show biodiesel has the highest energy balance of ANY fuel. A prominent USDA/DOE study shows for every unit of fossil fuel used to make biodiesel, 3.2 units of energy are gained in energy output. That's a 320% increase and includes soybean planting, harvesting, fuel production and transportation.

•Read the USDA/DOE Study

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Old 08-06-2005, 05:44 PM   #17
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Default Biodiesel much cleaner than all petro based fuels

clean fuel
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Old 08-06-2005, 05:47 PM   #18
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Default Finally

What good is a clean fuel if it is too expensive to produce it... You logic seems flawed dude. Engineering has taught me that successful engineering is all about compromises... Seems like your emissions point is irrelevant...
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Old 08-06-2005, 06:06 PM   #19
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Default Re: Production Of Fuel Cell Motorcycles Begins

"This past year the price of an oil barrel on the world oil market has hit an all time high."



Is that inflation-adjusted? Methinks not.



"Here in Europe, the fuel prices are already considerably higher than in the US."



Because of taxation, not supply-and-demand.



"A similar development already seems to have affected the US car market considering the somewhat unexpected sales success of the Toyotas hybrid engine technology."



A ridiculous fad, not nearly as big as everyone's making it.



"Its combination of a conventional fuel motor with several electric engines seems to result in considerable better gas mileage"



Honda CRX's were getting 50 mpg back in '85. Priuses are getting less than that in the real world.



"The added advantage of this hybrid technology is that the electric engines, while noise-wise rather unspectacular, can be very nice torque monsters - they may outperform even big block fuel-based motors."



And the disadvantages are - added complexity, added cost, and battery packs that will require replacement after 60,000 miles or so for a couple thousand dollars and, being huge and lead-acid, will be an environmental disaster to dispose of. On balance, hybrids are more environmentally destructive than a standard car. Oh, and apparently, emergency crews aren't thrilled about working near these things - something about the shock danger.



"In about ten to twenty years we might see that mineral oil-based fuel has become so expensive that its use even in motorcycles may no longer be affordable for Joe Public. "



Heard the same thing in the '70's. According to Paul Ehrlich and his crew, we were supposed to be oilless, frozen in the pollution-caused Ice Age, and starving by now.



Back to the fuel cells - if they do catch on, I hope they have evaporation collectors on them - imagine New York City in the summer with every car spitting water vapor. Of course, between the NIMBYs and the trial lawyers, there will never be hydrogen filling stations of the density of present day gas stations, so it's moot.
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Old 08-06-2005, 06:08 PM   #20
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Default Re: Finally

What fuel do you use in your biodiesal car, kpaul?
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