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Old 04-01-2005, 08:17 AM   #31
SeanAlexander
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Default Re: Sportbikers lead police on chase

Amen! I break traffic laws (on occasion) but I know the rules and if I am violating them, then I risk the punishment that goes along with it. I don't think this is a "Big Brother" issue, I think it is simple common sense. When you are caught breaking the law, be prepared to pay the price that is associated with that particular violation.



However, If you happen to be riding a "2003 Yamaha 750", by all means RUN and when you get home, make a couple million bucks selling the bike to a collector.
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Old 04-01-2005, 08:24 AM   #32
BMW4VWW
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Default Re: Sportbikers lead police on chase

I don't know what'goes on in other states, but a recent commentary that I wrote for our local paper, defending someone that wanted a jury trial for a speeding ticket, here in Northern California may give you some understanding why some people show disregard for law enforcement when it comes to traffic stops.



A recent letter in the Daily News exemplifies one of

the reasons behind the creeping totalitarianism in our

country. The letter, a half clever attempt a sarcasm

by John Minton, attempted to deride Don BirdÂ’s reason

for demanding a jury trial for a speeding ticket.

Apparently Mr. Minton feels that Mr. BirdÂ’s quest for

fairness in a court proceeding is a frivolous exercise

because according to some silly outmoded document,

called the Constitution of the United States of

America, people have a guaranteed right to a jury

trial if the amount exceeds twenty dollars.

Mr. Minton makes the point that court dockets are too

full to allow people, that are perhaps being fleeced

out of their hard earned money, a trial judged by

their peers. What people of Mr. Mintons ilk fail to

grasp is that perhaps our court dockets are too

crowded because we add about 1,000 new laws every year

here in California, and that doesnÂ’t include new

federal laws. These laws are happily enforced by

numerous police agencies full of people that earn nice

salaries doing so, and then the folks accused of

breaking these laws are tried in our court system by

more people that earn even higher salaries for doing

so. Those folks that refuse to pay those fines wind up

going to prison where yet more people earn great

salaries and a fantastic retirement plan, for

imprisoning them.

Care to guess where a lot of the money that pays all

of these people comes from? Why itÂ’s the fines and

taxes paid by the very folks that arenÂ’t allowed a

trial by jury. Add this to the mix. Back in 1990 when

our state was going through one of itÂ’s many financial

crises, the state looked at our municipal courts and

realized that here were some cash cows that the state

wasnÂ’t milking, so Democrat Assemblyman Phil Eisenberg

introduced Assembly Bill 1296. This bill took 74% of

the money that the municipal courts had been keeping

for their own counties, and transferred those moneys

into the states coffers. Realizing that the local

constables might not be as zealous in their revenue

generation now that the state was taking the lionÂ’s

share, the next year the same Assemblyman introduced

AB 590. This bill stated that from now on each county

must generate enough money from fines to meet or

exceed those generated in the baseline fiscal year of

1990/1991, or the state would take the difference out

of the offending countyÂ’s general fund. In short,

despite what officer friendly may tell you, yes Mr.

Minton there is a QUOTA for traffic tickets. To make

this goal easier to meet, and to generate even more

income, the state mandated an exponential increase in

traffic fines. Don BirdÂ’s ticket was $190!

So what we have here is a large group of people that

enforce, and adjudicate laws from which they garner

their livelihoods. Sort of makes one wonder just how

necessary all of these tickets are, doesnÂ’t it?

Remember all of those law enforcement officers

dutifully writing those tickets enforcing the 55 mph

speed limit? "Drive 55", it saves lives they said. It

was for our own good, wasnÂ’t it? As it turns out

traffic fatalities went down after the speed limit was

raised to 70 mph. Does anyone believe that every

ticket written now is strictly for public safety? If

going 80 mph on an uncrowded freeway is so dangerous,

why does the officer feel itÂ’s safe for him to go 90

mph to catch up, and write a ticket? Are these people

blessed with some sort of super human abilities?

How are we as citizens supposed to balance out these

inequities? Jury trials are the answer. ArenÂ’t we as

jurors bound only to judge whether the law was broken,

or not, as the judge instructs us to do? The dirty

little secret, that despite what the judge tells

you, and what he desperately doesnÂ’t want you do know,

is that jurors have always had the right to judge if

the law was a good one, or if it was being applied

fairly. The State of New Hampshire has a measure on

the ballot right now to force their judiciary to

properly advise the jurors of these rights. The jury

was envisioned by our forefathers to be the fourth

branch of our government. The jury is the final

safeguard when the other three branches of government

come up with, and try to enforce schemes like the one

outlined above. Perhaps if we had jury trials for

these "infractions" we could put a stop the this

silliness, and only the most egregious offenders, that

really are public dangers, would come to trial.

A very wise man once said "All that is necessary for

evil to succeed is that good men do nothing." We all

owe the Don Birds of this world a debt of gratitude.

Thank you Don Bird.



Van William Washburn
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Old 04-01-2005, 08:35 AM   #33
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Default Re: Sportbikers lead police on chase

Okay, I totally don't have time to read all of that at work. I will say this:I served on a jury in TX for a traffic violation. The guy was disrespectful, insulting the cop and even the jury, he was condiscending to the cop when he was pulled over for weaving, not having a TX license, and something else that I can't remember. In my opinion the cop showed amazing restraint in his dealing with him. It took him a year and half to get his court date and cost him a fortune. He admitted to every charge, claimed to not be a US citizen even though he has lived here his whole life, and quoted Braveheart in his opening statement. Yea we found him guilty on every charge and we more than a little upset for being pulled out of work for such a frivolous thing.
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Old 04-01-2005, 08:46 AM   #34
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Default Re: Sportbikers lead police on chase

Actually, you have videotape all over this website showing you breaking traffic laws. Of course that videotape is much appreciated and encouraged.



I have found on my bike the best chance of not getting a ticket is pulling over immediately, take off helmet, turn off bike and remove key, tell the cop that you need to take off the seat to get the registration and insurance, make slow deliberate movements, and no matter what the name tag says his or her name is Sir or Maam. And give a sincere thank you when they let you go.



I even got out of a 75+ in a 35 ticket tearing out of a bar after midnight in a small, small TX town.
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Old 04-01-2005, 09:02 AM   #35
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Default Re: Sportbikers lead police on chase

We don't have jury trials for traffic violations here in Kalifornia. If you have time read my commentary and you will see why you are lucky to have them in Texas. VWW
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Old 04-01-2005, 09:16 AM   #36
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Default Re: Sportbikers lead police on chase

I didn't feel lucky that day. It is a complete waste of my time to have to sit in court all day while a smartalic, saracastic dentist, explains repeatedly that he did do each of the violations he was charged with, but US traffic laws don't apply to him because he claims to be a citizen of the virgin islands and he shouldn't have to wear a seatbelt because the salesperson at the dodge dealership told him that it can carry more than 1500lbs of cargo, despite being defined by the state of Texas as well as dodge as three quarter ton pick up. Which, then, you weren't required to wear a seltbeat in heavy duty pickups.



Sometimes IQ needs to take a backseat to common sense. If I find myself in traffic court someday over a minor violation, I won't feel cheated by the system because I didn't have the chance to yank 6 people away from their daily lives to listen to why traffic laws don't pertain to me.
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Old 04-01-2005, 09:19 AM   #37
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Default Re: Sportbikers lead police on chase

I take it that you havn't had the time to read my commentary. VWW
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Old 04-01-2005, 09:26 AM   #38
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Default Re: Sportbikers lead police on chase

Okay read the whole thing. I am unconvinced. It is a bunch of half logics to justify unlawful behavior.



"If going 80 mph on an uncrowded freeway is so dangerous, why does the officer feel itÂ’s safe for him to go 90 mph to catch up, and write a ticket?"



If I shoot at a cop he shouldn't get to shoot back because he might hit a bystander or it is his fault if I hit a bystander?



The alternative to a cop chasing after a speeder is installing GPS in every vehicle and having tickets slide out your dash everytime you speed. It's cheap and much more effective and efficient. (The opening scene to Seaquest with Roy Schnieder on a motorcycle.)
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Old 04-01-2005, 09:35 AM   #39
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Default Re: Sportbikers lead police on chase

Funny that you didn't mention the states placement of quotas of traffic violations for the express purpose of revenue generation, and the ramifications it might have on other government schemes to fleece the people out of even more money. I guess you really are a pro police state sort of guy. BTW the police already have guide lines for when it is safe to shoot back and a criminal. VWW
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Old 04-01-2005, 09:53 AM   #40
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Default Re: Sportbikers lead police on chase

The guy sounds like a moron. One question though:



Can you point out the statutes making condescencion towards police illegal?



Almost every cop I come into contact with seem to find it a duty to show limitless condescencion and demand submissiveness. Does this legally only flow one way?
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