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Old 08-31-2004, 04:02 AM   #161
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Default Re: Is it generational?

I'm 35, you dork.
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Old 08-31-2004, 04:23 AM   #162
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Default Re: Is it generational?

Oh, yeah. "You want to stand up in the front seat, boy? Okay, just don't fall; your mother will be upset."

I didn't say we actually used the lap belts in the Mercury! We also had one of those rumble seat-type things that opened up from the floor and faced backward. No belts on that thing, of course. And plenty of sharp metal edges. We loved it.

When I got older, my friends and I experimented with all sorts of ways to injure ourselves...and usually succeeded. My mom used to come home to us jumping over each other (and just about anything else we could find) on BMX bikes on some huge, badly-engineered ramp we spent half the day building. "Dangerous" team sports like football, baseball and hockey were encouraged, not fretted over. We all lived.

I'm not saying there's anything wrong with kids wearing helmets on bicycles, or wearing gear when when skateboarding. That's fine with me. I just feel like there's this oppressive atmosphere these kids live in. It feels like they're missing out on a little bit of growing up.
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Old 08-31-2004, 07:16 AM   #163
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Default Re: Indian Larry Killed in Helmetless Stunt

Indian Larry might have been the social outsider, the live-hard-and-fast type, and hey, much respect, love, and mad props for it.

But my guess is that his lifestyle coupled with his age made this kind of stunt too dangerous for him. Had any young, strong, coordinated, X-games or LVE stunter whippersnapper who is used to crashing 5 times a day fell off the bike, in all likelihood they would have walked away with a skinned knee. Frail, aged, and faculties-failing Indian Larry probably shouldn't have been trying to perform his little stunt without a helmet.

Oh, and most sportbike stunters who do this every day still wear helmets.

I'll fight against helmet laws all day long, but I'll still say that Indian Larry was stupid for doing this without a helmet and we should all learn our lesson from it. We can celebrate Larry's life but frankly the way he died was stupid and unneccessary. If I go out on my bike I hope it's in a blaze-of-glory 150mph wreck and not falling off and bumping my noggin whilst standing on the seat at bicycle speeds.
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Old 08-31-2004, 09:00 AM   #164
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Default Maybe you can go out like this guy!!

POSTED: 11:01 am CDT August 31, 2004

UPDATED: 11:44 am CDT August 31, 2004

CHICAGO -- A 39-year-old motorcyclist was run over by a tractor-trailer early Tuesday when he tried to pass the vehicle on the Dan Ryan Expressway while traveling about 100 mph.

James Sumler (pictured, left), of an unknown address, was pronounced dead at 3:20 a.m. at the Stein Institute, a Cook County medical examiner's office spokesman said.

Images: Motorcyclist Killed While Trying To Pass Vehicle

Sumler lived in Chicago, according to state police District Chicago Sgt. Theodore Whittier.

Sumler was riding a Kawasaki ZX900 motorcycle, Whittier said.

Sumler's wife and mother said they cannot believe the news.

"He was cautious -- he was very cautious," his wife Janene said. "He was always constantly aware of what was going on around him."

Sumler's family said he had just completed a safety driving course and had just gotten his motorcycle, NBC5 reported.

An autopsy was scheduled for Tuesday, the medical examiner's office spokesman said.

The accident occurred at about 1:40 a.m., when the truck struck the motorcycle in the southbound lanes of the expressway near 79th Street, a District Chicago state police sergeant said. The motorcyclist was killed and there were no other injuries, the sergeant said.

According to witnesses, the man had been riding with about 20 other motorcycles at speeds of more than 100 mph, said a state trooper who was at the scene.

At about 79th Street, the man attempted to pass between the truck and a concrete wall by using the two-foot-wide shoulder, the trooper said.

The motorcyclist lost control of his vehicle and it hit the wall, the trooper said. He then went beneath the truck and was run over.

The man's body rolled away from the truck, but his motorcycle was dragged beneath the trailer as far as 89th Street before the trucker noticed sparks emitting from near the trailer's rear tires, the trooper said.

When the truck driver curbed her truck, she expected to find a flat tire, the trooper said. Instead, she found the motorcycle and immediately called police.

The man's body remained near 79th Street, to where state police were called by motorists who had stopped to assist, the trooper said. The man had been wearing a helmet, the trooper said.

The other bikers did not stop, he added.

All lanes on the Dan Ryan Expressway were open as of 6 a.m., the trooper said.

Charges were not expected, the sergeant said

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Old 08-31-2004, 09:56 AM   #167
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Default Re: So let's not learn from the fact that...

"What gives YOU the right to apply YOUR book to other peoples lives? -Sean"

It is what we do every day. It is the formation of our society. Whether helmet laws are a good or bad thing is available for debate. The idea that your "individual freedom" is infringed by them is not. I hate to tell everyone that is seriously offended by the notion of helmet laws, but YOU HAVE NO RIGHT NOT TO BE TOLD TO WEAR A HELMET. Thats right, there is no liberty interest, nothing fundimental to the American way of life, hell, no good philisophical rational to have the freedom from having helmet laws.

This is different from saying there should or should not be helmet laws, which is another issue. All I am saying is that there absolutely should be the ability to institute helmet laws (and age restrictions for drivers licences, and seatbelt laws, and taxes, and to make OSHA regulatuions, and to be able to enforce contracts, and ... well you pick the law). As long as it does not interfere with a realm that 1. would otherwise limit the democratic process, or 2. so invasive to "personal liberty" as to be outside the realm of what the governemnt should be able to infringe upon, (here is where you may want to um, hang your hat, but sorry, general welfare and safty is the area where it has always been ok for government to legislate, kinda the point of governemnt doncha think?) or 3. there is some other ultimate prohibition on enacting that kind of law (usually a bad idea for specific things like um say prohibition, or constitutional definitions of marriage, but a good idea for broad principles).

So Sean to answer your question, no one really has the right to apply his/her book to other peoples lives (and be able to enforce it. But if you believe in America (meaning the foundational doctrine of our form of governemnt, which is a republican form of representational democracy, just to remind people who seem to always forget), then you belive in the ability for the PEOPLE to apply it's book to how YOU live your life. If that is through a helmet law, so be it. I hate to say it, but if that is to ban all motorcycles, or place rediculous horsepower restrictions on them, so be it as well. Howerver, if you dont want this to happen, dont elect people who would do these things, just dont kid yourself that there is any "right" or "individual freedom" or it infringes on your "liberty" to ride motorcycles without a helmet.
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Old 08-31-2004, 10:36 AM   #169
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Default Re: Maybe you can go out like this guy!!

ouch.....I was thinking more along the lines ofa fiery crash on the racetrack, I tend not to do the kind of stuff that this guy was apparently attempting.

Most of my riding consists of twisty and extremely familiar roads with sparse traffic, or the local riding spot, an industrial park with twisty one-way two-lane roads that is all but deserted on the weekends/nights. And the track, of course.
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