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Old 07-13-2004, 10:55 PM   #41
allbikesbiker
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Default Re: Motorcycle fatalities in the Sacramento Area

well, the difference was, and still is, ground clearance.

the dyna will scrape and fold long before the old 750

so, HP wasn't a factor. *In my opinion*.

I'd say he went in hot, leaned too far, lifted the tires via pegs/boards scraping and went straight.
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Old 07-14-2004, 01:55 AM   #42
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Default Re: Motorcycle fatalities in the Sacramento Area

I think they should have enacted a mandatory helmet law and none of these guys would have.........Oh it happened in Californy. Never mind.
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Old 07-14-2004, 02:57 AM   #43
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Default Re: Defending British Motojournalist and Html for Dummies

I live the closest to the Captain. One slap forthcoming!
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Old 07-14-2004, 03:05 AM   #44
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Default Re: Motorcycle fatalities in the Sacramento Area

I bet he never even got close to scraping the pegs. He probably did get in hot, shyt his pants and hit the brakes, stood it up, and plowed the tree. Seldom does a new rider lean enough to lift the tires because they get scared. Hell, seldom does an experienced rider do that. Unless you know better, the first reaction is to hit the brakes and stand it up.
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Old 07-14-2004, 04:25 AM   #45
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Default Re: now to wax philisophic

Thomas Hobbes, From Leviathan:

[A description of the state of Nature, before man forms society]:



<blockquote>Whatsoever therefore is consequent to a time of war, where every man is enemy to every man, the same consequent to the time wherein men live without other security than what their own strength and their own invention shall furnish them withal. In such condition there is no place for industry, because the fruit thereof is uncertain: and consequently no culture of the earth; no navigation, nor use of the commodities that may be imported by sea; no commodious building; no instruments of moving and removing such things as require much force; no knowledge of the face of the earth; no account of time; no arts; no letters; no society; and which is worst of all, continual fear, and danger of violent death; and the life of man, solitary, poor, nasty, brutish, and short. </blockquote>
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Old 07-14-2004, 04:56 AM   #46
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Default Re: Motorcycle fatalities in the Sacramento Area

Sean's exactly right. Training and some basic education probably would have helped the Harley guy, but the other two were victims of stupidity, and a failure to understand the consequences of their actions. Motorcycles require an extraordinary amount of skill to ride safely, and to ride fast requires skill, practice and judgement. Reckless abandon tends to yield results similar to those described above.



As a semi-related note, I have a friend here who recently mentioned that, as a first bike, he wanted a Harley Fat Boy or something equivalent. I had a fairly detailed and graphic conversation with him about why that was horrible decision, the consequences of errors particularly on land barges like the Fat Boy, his complete ignorance on handling that or any other bike, and have (hopefully) convinced him that starting with something more reasonable, a la a Sportster (he likes the Harley image, which I couldn't talk him out of), would to wonders for extending his riding career.



All that being said, I think that we as a society are already coddled and overprotected by regulation, law and rule. Mandatory airbags and ABS in cars are a great example of this. Your cost is pushed up and choices are taken from you because some jerk-off got all teary eyed about someone dying in their car. That really pisses me off. Life in general has a defined outcome - death - and this culture of safety really is a degenerate notion that attempts to sap our humanity (note: part of my ***** is that a reasonably priced, light-weight sportscar physically can't be built with today's auto regulations).



That's part of the reason I love motorcycles; by their inherent nature they can not be made passively safe - safety requires active participation from the rider. Even then there are risks, of course.



This discussion really has two components though: the degredation of the human spirit, and idiots who kill themselves by acting the fool.



Okay, now I'm rambling.



cdg
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Old 07-14-2004, 05:10 AM   #47
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Default Re: Ignorance Is Not a Tort

Fortunately for you, and the uninformed mass (read liberals generally) ignorance and stupidity are not recognized causes of action in Federal or state courts. However, in the court of public opinion, you are guilty as charged. Wait a minute... The Captain could sue for intentional infliction of emotional distress. We could easily certify it as a class action given your posts on this site. That would get John Edwards' attention, he'd resign from the race (dollars over politics), and you'd be getting screwed by a fellow liberal. How poetic.
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Old 07-14-2004, 06:07 AM   #48
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Default Re: Defending British Motojournalist and Html for Dummies

Thank you sir, may I have another?
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Old 07-14-2004, 06:21 AM   #49
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Default Re: Motorcycle fatalities in the Sacramento Area

Rider education is impotant, but so is common sense and mental maturity. On the day in 1965 that I turned 14, I walked into the local Highway Patrol office, took a 20 minute written exam and walked out with a valid motorcycle operator's license. Its probably a good thing that I did not own a bike at the time. By the end of that year, one of my neighborhood friends had hit and killed a 6-year-old girl on the street with his S-90, and another had crashed and sustained head injuries that left him with slurred speech and using a walker through highschool.

Would rider training have helped? I don't know. It may just be the psycho-social phenomenon that risk-takers are attracted to motorcycles. Add to that the fact that every movie involving motorcycles and virtually every TV ad for any type of vehicle features illegal and/or extremely dagerous driving, and you create a potentially disasterous mind-set in those weened on "Jackass" reruns.

It helps to keep me safer when I think about those old friends before slinging a leg over a bike.
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Old 07-14-2004, 06:40 AM   #50
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Default Re: Motorcycle fatalities in the Sacramento Area

"That's part of the reason I love motorcycles; by their inherent nature they can not be made passively safe - safety requires active participation from the rider. Even then there are risks, of course."



HOLY SHYT! A guy with common sense rambled in here. Amazing! Not only does that quote above makes sense, but the whole damn thing did. I figure you to be KPauled to death soon, or you are destined to become one of the ZRX_Bullshyt dwarves. Good going.
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