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Old 06-18-2003, 09:58 AM   #61
tumbler
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No you just think I'm grasping at straws because I disagree with you. You just used my line of reasoning, you don't own the roads, you don't have a right to use the road. Drivers education 1st day "driving is privilege not a right". Yes getting out of bed in the morning is a dangerous activity, some people die in their sleep, and no these activities should not be outlawed. Okay it's a gorgeous day outside, I'm having the same conversation with like 3-4 different people who either just like to argue or really think a helmet law is just another example of the man trying to keep them down, probably a little of both. All of you go on as if your opinion is RIGHT one and if someone has a different one not noly are they wrong they obviously have an inferior intellect or something. This issue that doesn't truely have a concrete right or wrong answer. Why don't you just admit you don't like living in a country where not only people are entitled to not think like you but sometimes they get laws passed that you don't like. This isn't directed at you alone longride, it's to the other couple of people I've been arguing with also. Someone called me comrade, someone suggested I leave this country because I support this particular helmet law, when people get this fanatical over little stuff it's never going to have a good outcome. This is getting to point if I said that at least wearing a helmet meant you could have a open casket funeral, I get 10 people giving my all of the weird exceptions to this and the ones that are a little smarter or maybe just a little more of a smart ass would say that it doesn't matter because they are going to be cremated.
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Old 06-18-2003, 10:01 AM   #62
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Well yea, his head bounced off pavement, he didn't have any internal injuries, or brocken bones. This is a rhetoical question, you don't think helmets help prevent head trauma.
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Old 06-18-2003, 10:06 AM   #63
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Default Re: PA Helmet Law Changing

So, the big problem is who will pay for the thousands of melmetless bikers sitting in the hospital with head injuries? (not likely)

Why, that will be the same people that pay for the millions of indigent drug addicts, gun shot victims and other refuse clogging the system. We all will. Who cares? The number of helmetless riders without health insurance is a drop in the bucket.
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Old 06-18-2003, 10:11 AM   #64
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here we go again!! I wish that people like this editor would get his facts straight!! In '68, lots of states introduced helmet laws not to protect motorcyclist, but to safe-guard federal high-way dollors that were in danger. The safty nazis in D.C., in there infinite wisdom decided that they knew what was best for us, and the states caved in. He mentioned as increase in biker deaths over the past few years, while inferring that the increase had something to do with helmet law repels. The truth is that, while some states that have repeled their helmet laws have seen an increase in motorcycle deaths, they have also seen an increase in cycle registration. There is no real data that links repel with increased deaths!! As far as the "burden to society is concerned", don't we pay taxe's too? Don't we carry insurance as well? Those of us who ride should be allowed to decide this issue!!
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Old 06-18-2003, 10:13 AM   #65
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You are grasping because your arguments aren't correct. They lied to you in drivers ed. You do own the roads. The govt. took my money, and yours, and built them. It's public domain, just as schools, libraries and parks are. I can go to them and they can't keep me out. I'm part owner, and as part owner it's my job to see they dont' f&ck things up by passing stupid laws restricting access to something that is mine. Road closures to motorcycles have happened often. Is that a fair law? Not by a long shot. Forcing ones "opinion" on someone else is the main problem with your argument. that is where the "comrade" comes from. I hate smokers, threfore all smoking shall be banned, I hate fat people, therefore all Burger Kings are closed, I hate un-helmeted riders therefore...... get it?? Forcing your views on ME for my own good is wrong any way you want to slice it. Laws in this country are more about contol than benefit. They have been for about 100 years now. The brainwashing started when they told you driving is a "privlidge" and you have no right to use the road the govt. built with MY MONEY. Bullshyt! If you want to believe that crap, go ahead. I want to believe that I will act to preserve what little freedoms I have left.
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Old 06-18-2003, 10:14 AM   #66
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Sales/usage taxes. When I pay 43 cents per gallon in gasoline taxes, that money should be used for transportation--period. Maintain roads, test helmets, etc. Property taxes should maintain city infrastructure. Taxes on clothing, cat litter, wrenches, etc. go towards general government responsibilities, such as national defense. Income taxes should be dropped, as they are used to punish successful people. This pre-supposes, of course, that we pare down the various levels of government mightily. My suburb just spent $250,000 on a cast iron arch going over one of the roads coming into town. Wanna come see it, promote tourism? Giving more money in the form of income taxes to any government is just handing crack to the addicts. If my 'burb didn't get $2000 from me last year in income taxes, could they have afforded that sign?
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Old 06-18-2003, 10:18 AM   #67
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(trembling lower lip) You...you don't _really_ hate fat people, do you, longrid?
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Old 06-18-2003, 10:26 AM   #68
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You mean we went through all of this and we agree. You miss understood what I was saying. I was citing my grandfather's accident as evidence (not proof, I'm a science teacher so I know better!) that helmet do increase the chances living through an accident. This was NOT to imply everyone should have to wear a helmet all of the time. We get to busy trying to one up each other we lose sight. My grandmother swears to this day that was the only time she can remember my grandfather riding w/o a helmet. His actions did have consquences that went beyond himself. He knew better, and if he were alive and saw me riding w/o a helmet he'd kick my butt! He was however old enough, experienced enough to make that decision on his own. I wrecked my first motorcycle the first month I had it. I aced my MSF course, I practice in parking lots, was only going 45 around that decreasing radius turn, it became a choice between lay the bike down or risk going over a guardrail with about 20 foot drop. I totalled my bike, had some road rash, (wearing shorts and Tennis shoes), and took a chunk out of my foot. Head bounced off one of the posts too. I was twenty three, trained, and not being stupid on a ex 500. What stuck with was one how out of control I was during the actually crash and slide (For a gymnast who is used to having my body flinging out of control it was a hard pill to swallow) and two how scratched up my helmet was. Most new and young riders, and probably anyone who hasn't actually been down, I doubt really understand and appreciated how fast it can happen and how helpless you are if it does. I truely believe that is the spirit of this legislation, not to slowly take away our riding privileges like that butt-head in AZ that wanted helmetless rider fatalities to be automatic organ donors. Now that is taking away a fundamental right to have bodies treated however we choose postmortem (sp?)
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Old 06-18-2003, 10:42 AM   #69
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"with liberty and justice for all". Sound familiar? It closes the pledge of allegiance. Once liberty and justice are taken what will there be to fight for? Who will be left to fight for it? Alan Sherman's "The Rape of the A.P.E." eloquently and in an entertaining way spelled out the situation freedom loving people need to struggle against over a quarter century ago. American life blood has been spilled around the World for rights that are being taken with barely a murmer from most. I believe this is a grave disservice to their memories. Yes, I support another adults freedom to decide whether or not to wear a helmet! How long do you think it will be before the 99% of the public that doesn't ride will decide Motorcycling itself places an injustified and unwarranted burden on society? Which little freedom or right will be taken from you that will sensitize you to these losses for others?
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Old 06-18-2003, 10:45 AM   #70
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Apparently not!
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