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Old 06-18-2003, 06:53 PM   #101
seruzawa
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Default Re: PA Helmet Law Changing

From what I've seen Driver's Licenses are a big joke. People drive without them all the time. People who are obviously incompetent behind the wheel are given new licenses regularly.



Think of a better example. There is no evidence that bothering with licenses really does much good, if any.
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Old 06-18-2003, 07:06 PM   #102
Weezel
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Default Re: PA Helmet Law Changing

It is my opinion that it should be illegal to discuss helmet laws on any website under the Patriot Act. I move this topic be censored by the MO webmaster, whoever that may be.
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Old 06-18-2003, 07:37 PM   #103
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Default Re: All fine and nice, IF...

And that is the kind of conclusion you get when you over simplify.



What vehical are you most like to get hurt in/on during an accident?



Which vehical is going to cause the most damage to other people and property?



A car that is involved in an accident is FAR more likely to cause damage to others than the driver/passengers.



A motorcycle involved in and accident is more likely to cause injury to the rider/passenger.



We pay the rates we pay because

a) that's what the market will bear

b) they fit the vehicals accident and damage rates.



Keep in mind that on your insurance policies, auto, motorcycle what have you, there are property and medical provisions.



People involved in motorcycle accidents with no helmets are more likely to get life long head injuries. By removing the helmet law, or giving the rider the same insurance rates reguardless of helmet or not penelizes everyone else with the medical bills.



Insurance copanies haven't been any wiser to this yet, but it is high time they were.
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Old 06-18-2003, 08:15 PM   #104
KPaulCook
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Default Re: What about cops?

Cops should wear full faces. Some, the ones who ride BMWs not Harleys, wear the flip up ones here. However, most wear the CHiPs style. In Europe cops wear the flip up jobs and high vis retroreflective vests. I'll bet you can't get the King County (Greater Seattle) sheriffs dept to wear those vests. King County Sheriffs Dept has a kick ass ask questions latter rep unlike the ridiculously politically correct Seattle cops. My neighborhood got a lot better when a King County Deputy moved in.
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Old 06-18-2003, 08:20 PM   #105
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Default Freedom has a price.

Riding/Driving is legally a privilege not a right, so I really don't fall for the freedom thing but hey I don't care if you are an idiot who doesn't wear a full face. However, don't expect insurance companies, hospitals or the taxpayers to pay for your foolishness if you get a head injury. As they say freedom has a price.
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Old 06-18-2003, 08:24 PM   #106
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Default Best Post here Excellent Point

"Try looking at the growing trend of insurance companies that don't cover motorcyclists (or rock climbers, ATV riders or water skiiers) because it's a "high-risk" activity. " You are absolutely right. Thanks for the post.
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Old 06-18-2003, 09:02 PM   #107
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Default Re: Tumbler

I'll take your bait, but this is the only reply you'll get from me. Because I think it is okay for limited helmet laws, doesn't make me a socialist. Expressing an view different from yours doesn't make me unintelligent. Thinking your own opinions can be the only right ones does make a person an egomaniac. Equating helmet laws with big tyrannical government is foolhearty at best. It's totally in this country and with me personally to be against helmet laws, but for people to get worked up to the point of belittling and name calling over such a triviality is immature. Which ever side of this particular issue you're on if you don't have bigger things to get worked up over, even as a motorcyclist, you must lead a much more carefree life than I. Of course that is why I started riding in the first place, to have a way off relaxing, unwinding, for a tankful of gas forget about the injustices of the world.
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Old 06-18-2003, 09:05 PM   #108
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Default Re: Tumbler

Okay you apologized and I don't feel like starting another flame war. So let me start be saying I don't like or want government in every aspect of my life or your's. Obviously me speak my mind rankles you. What Rankled me was you jumping in the middle my arguement with longride, who actually I think jumped in when I was try to give a difference of opinion to someone else. Hey I've been guilty of this myself, it happens. Actually, there is legislation, or at least the threat of it for hair dryers, that's why they have all of the warning labels on. My belief in freedom in general, not just helmet laws for inexperienced riders, is that we get as much freedom as we possibly can have until it impinges on someone else's.

Oh and as far as the bubble wrap thing, I told a buddy of mine who I started riding with at the same time that statement and he laughed his ass off! I was always the kid who had to climb the highest in the tree, compete when the trainers told me not to, and did a track day in blue jeans, hiking boots, mesh riding jacket, plain unarmored gloves and a $100 helmet. I was out of bubble wrap that day and I spent my crack money on the cheap helmet. When government tries to put horspower limits on motorcycles, I'll write my representatives. When they tell me I can't put after market exhaust on my bike (Even though I no intention of putting one on my bike), I'll write. The day they decide that human drivers and riders are too dangerous an try to make a completely automated highway system, I'll run for office. This isn't far fetched, they've been developing the technology in Australia for over a decade now! I just don't have problem with a law that makes what are essentially inexperienced street riders have to wear a minimum of protect, i.e. a helmet. To me it's like people with learner's pemits having to have an adult licensed driver in the car with them. Now the fact that I had to pay taxes on my motorcycle when I bought it after the government already made money off the bike when the first person that owned it bought, so basically they are double and eventually probably triple dipping, that chaps my butt more than being forced to wear an uncomfortable helmet.



P.S. You're lucky I didn't get to ride today because it start thunderstorming, which is probably the real reason I have kept taking part in all of these flame wars as long as I have. I had to settle for a Astros game instead.
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Old 06-18-2003, 09:20 PM   #109
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Default Re: Tumbler

Nice to see there are actually some friendly people here. This is why I and others as I have read, don't post much here. Not because the people's arguements are so ironclad they can't be disputed, but because people get so worked up over this stuff and all of the sudden you're a facist for having a different opinion. Man when some of these people get going it reminds of being back at work with the teenagers who complain day after day about the school dress code, but they don't petition or take other action to get it changed. Or even worse fail to see how the school as whole is been getting a better press, test scores have gone up, and there have been less discipline problems. Nope they would rather ***** and moan during class instead of listening to lab directions or getting their work done and then getting upset when their grades are low because even though a dress code may be unfair they missed the more important stuff going on around them.

Sorry to go off on a tangent there Capt, but I have a feeling others reading this ready to jump.
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Old 06-18-2003, 09:25 PM   #110
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Default Re: Helmet Laws Bite!

Let's spout a bunch of unrelated nonsense and call it an argument.
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