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Old 05-11-2010, 06:41 PM   #381
Jofaba
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As long as I'm using the clutch for my shifting, is there any immediate danger that I pose to my bike while learning through these mishaps? I mean can it take a little abuse during my first few days?

Q: Do you generally find yourself dropping back down into first all all during a ride? What's the highest gear you'd recommend being at a stop light at? I don't mean for quick take offs; I mean what would you downshift to as you approach a stop light?

Last edited by Jofaba : 05-11-2010 at 06:45 PM.
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Old 05-11-2010, 07:06 PM   #382
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As long as I'm using the clutch for my shifting, is there any immediate danger that I pose to my bike while learning through these mishaps? I mean can it take a little abuse during my first few days?

Q: Do you generally find yourself dropping back down into first all all during a ride? What's the highest gear you'd recommend being at a stop light at? I don't mean for quick take offs; I mean what would you downshift to as you approach a stop light?
When you are stopped at a traffic light, your bike should be in first gear. For me, it's a simultaneous process of downshifting while coming to a stop.

As far as bikes go, most can take a little abuse -- some can take a lot. You should be fine. Learn away.
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Old 05-11-2010, 07:17 PM   #383
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Thanks for your help man! Looks like it's going to be a clear weekend so I know what I'll be doing. I hope I figure out how to come out of a stop without stalling the bike, because that's what's keeping me from even attempting town riding.

Supposed to rain tomorrow but if it hasn't started yet in the morning I'll probably take her for another spin and try your advice on downshifting.
Going to spend most of the night researching gear shifting in general.
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Old 05-11-2010, 07:56 PM   #384
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Thanks for your help man! Looks like it's going to be a clear weekend so I know what I'll be doing. I hope I figure out how to come out of a stop without stalling the bike, because that's what's keeping me from even attempting town riding.

Supposed to rain tomorrow but if it hasn't started yet in the morning I'll probably take her for another spin and try your advice on downshifting.
Going to spend most of the night researching gear shifting in general.
Did you bike come with an owner's manual? Most owner's manuals have suggestions for shift points (at what speed to upshift and downshift er gear).
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Old 05-11-2010, 08:12 PM   #385
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Yeah but it's confusing... (EDIT, no, not the original. I downloaded one in pdf. Thanks for reminding me about it though, going to read the section on shifting again. This down shift point chart makes no sense though)

SHIFT UP POINTS
1ST->2ND: 9.9mi/h
2ND->3RD: 14.9mi/h
3RD->4TH: 19.9mi/h
4TH->5TH: 24.9mi/h

SHIFT DOWN POINTS
5TH->4TH: 12.5mi/h
4TH->3RD: 12.5mi/h
3RD->2ND: 12.5mi/h
2ND-1ST: 12.5mi/h

So it says:

TO DECELERATE:
1. apply both the front and the rear brakes to slow the motorcycle.
2. shift the transmission into first gear when the motorcycle reaches 12.5mi/h. If the engine is about to stall or runs very roughly, pull the clutch lever in and use the brakes to stop the motorcycle.
3. shift the transmission into the neutral position when the motorcycle is almost completely stopped. the neutral indicator light should come on.

It makes it seem like you can shift down to first from any gear. Can you do multiple downshifts with a single clutch disengagement?

Last edited by Jofaba : 05-11-2010 at 08:23 PM.
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Old 05-11-2010, 08:31 PM   #386
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Originally Posted by Jofaba View Post
Yeah but it's confusing... (EDIT, no, not the original. I downloaded one in pdf. Thanks for reminding me about it though, going to read the section on shifting again. This down shift point chart makes no sense though)

SHIFT UP POINTS
1ST->2ND: 9.9mi/h
2ND->3RD: 14.9mi/h
3RD->4TH: 19.9mi/h
4TH->5TH: 24.9mi/h

SHIFT DOWN POINTS
5TH->4TH: 12.5mi/h
4TH->3RD: 12.5mi/h
3RD->2ND: 12.5mi/h
2ND-1ST: 12.5mi/h
Yeah. The downshift chart is bogus. One option is to turn the upshift chart on its head (i.e. downshift from 5th to 4th at 24 mph). I don't recommend that.

Usually, you would downshift from a higher gear to a lower gear at a slower speed than you would upshift. For example, if you upshift from 4th to 5th at 25 mph, then you would downshift from 5th to 4th around 18-20mph, 4th to 3rd at around 15-17 mph, etc. However, I'm not sure how this would work for your bike, because your numbers seem messed up.
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Old 05-11-2010, 08:35 PM   #387
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upshifting, I'm sure you can safely take the revs a little higher, downshifting you'll just have to feel the deceleration and know when your "drag" is fading & then drop another gear. I usually drop gears as I'm decelerating too, but if speed wasn't high or if braking uphill, I'll just use the brakes but don't forget prepare for 1st gear for takeoff regardless.
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Old 05-11-2010, 08:40 PM   #388
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Enlightenment?: (Thanks 13Mordeth video and Dr Sprocket)

Okay, I've been watching youtube videos trying to grasp Dr Sprocket's advice on downshifting, and came across a 13M video (not my first, he's great, and actually have seen this one before) where he talks about upshifting dropping his rpms around 1k and downshifting raising them about 1k.

It seems so simple in retrospect, that if you upshift when your rpm's are getting too high, that you'd downshift when they get too low. I wasn't doing that. I was treating the downshift as if it was required for slowing down.

I can't wait to get to try downshifting again now that I understand what you were saying. Thanks man, I really appreciate your posts and for helping me out =)

If I can put that concept into practice and it works, then the only basic operational problem I will need to overcome is taking off from a stopped position.

When I was stalling, I wasn't trying to give any throttle until I THOUGHT I felt myself entering the friction zone. That was harder to feel when I had my rear brake engaged. I got to the point where I refused to use my brake while engaging the clutch which sometimes lead to me doing it fast because I'd start to roll backwards.

I'm starting to feel confident that the fixes to my two biggest problems encountered today are within reach of being solved =)
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Old 05-11-2010, 08:46 PM   #389
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr_Sprocket View Post
Yeah. The downshift chart is bogus. One option is to turn the upshift chart on its head (i.e. downshift from 5th to 4th at 24 mph). I don't recommend that.

Usually, you would downshift from a higher gear to a lower gear at a slower speed than you would upshift. For example, if you upshift from 4th to 5th at 25 mph, then you would downshift from 5th to 4th around 18-20mph, 4th to 3rd at around 15-17 mph, etc. However, I'm not sure how this would work for your bike, because your numbers seem messed up.
Yeah it's odd isn't it? The manual seems legit. It's 96 pages and all the info sounds right. It'd be ridiculous for someone to put out a bogus manual for this specific motorcycle though...

I know what you mean, as there's a rev range from low to high, so you wouldn't drop at the same number. I think I'll go by what you said earlier and when my engine sounds too low, that's when I'll switch gears. Today I was switching entirely because I felt I should have been because I was slowing down. But third gear (I think thats where I was) felt and sounded perfectly fine for crawling past a Yield sign. But I felt I was doing it wrong and downshifted into second and that was like suddenly riding through six inches of syrup.
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Old 05-12-2010, 04:41 AM   #390
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Today I was switching entirely because I felt I should have been because I was slowing down. But third gear (I think thats where I was) felt and sounded perfectly fine for crawling past a Yield sign. But I felt I was doing it wrong and downshifted into second and that was like suddenly riding through six inches of syrup.
That's the joy of "learning" your bike. You gut told you third gear was wrong. Your gut was right. Stay safe out there!
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