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Old 05-19-2003, 03:38 PM   #11
Gabe
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Default A Salesman Speaks

Yep, those motorcycle dealers are getting SOOOO wealthy off "gouging" you by charging you their costs for freight and set-up, plus a little more to maybe adjust for regional differences in dealership operating costs. You can see the salesmen and dealership owners hop on their MV Agusta or into their BMW 7- series after a relaxing day of bilking poor, struggling motorcycle buyers of their paltry disposable income.



A CBR600RR costs the same in Memphis or Manhattan, but you can bet the dealer in Manhattan makes less money per bike. So he charges a little more.

Good for him. That's how he can keep the doors open and the lights on, and keep his parts stocked and employees happy.



Here's something fun that happened to me last Saturday. An affluent couple from one of the more exclusive neighborhoods of San Francisco pulled up outside our shop in their BMW SUV and wanted to see our cheapest scooter. I took the lady for a ride on two differnt models and spent two hours taking about scooters, gear, helmets, parking, etc. I have a great time with them, as they are nice people and also drive their Z8 on the racetrack for fun.



So we go into the office to do the paperwork, and they tell em they won't buy until they get the "best price". I sell them a 2002 for $100 less than a 2003, and offer a free cover. They threaten to walk unless I give them another $100 off.



That leaves us with a $300 profit margin, plus another $80 from our additional markups. I get 20% of that- so I'm paid about $70 for the only sale I made that friggin' week.



Your hammering for the best price takes money out of the pockets of men and women that are universally struggling right now. And do you really need that extra $100 or $500? I think the haggling is done just so the customer feels better.



But we work in the industry not to feel better, but to make a living for ourselves and our families. We also love motorcycles and motorsports, and support the industry at the most basic level. If it wasn't for us willing to work at near-poverty conditions, there would be no motorcycle industry!



I don't want to sound whiney. But please, please remember, you don't need to buy a bike to survive, but we need to sell them. So please, please be respectful of dealers and how they run their businesses.



Because once the "going out of business" sales are over, where will you buy your next bike?
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Old 05-19-2003, 04:46 PM   #12
nweaver
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Default Begging your pardon...

But I've experienced otherwise.



When I bought my EX500 two years ago, the difference in out the door price between the place where I purchased and other dealers was over $800, and mostly because of nuisance charges. And I doubt most was to cover overhead.



The dealer I purchased from charged $75 for prep (the EX500 is a quick setup, but may be slighly undercharged, I'd say it was perhaps 1.5 hr shoptime total, including the tech briefing) and $75 freight (roughly what Kawasaki charges). Other dealers wanted $300! for prep, >$100 for freight, and another $75 for "doc" fees.



I don't like barganing in person, it takes a LOT of time (dealer and yours) for perhaps a couple hundred bucks. It's generally better (and easier) to just call several dealers and ask for OTD price quotes, it saves time for all involved.
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Old 05-19-2003, 05:30 PM   #13
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Default Re: Set-up and Dock fees?

You don't get it do ya? The world is supposed to be handed to everyone on a platter and if anything goes wrong the government is supposed to fix it. Watch out fer yerself? Any such attitude is not PC.



Where ya been the last few years?
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Old 05-19-2003, 06:20 PM   #14
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Default Re: A Salesman Speaks

Do I really need that extra $100 or $500? You're damn right I do, every bit as much as the dealer does - and in your example, if I end up paying the extra money, the salesman only gets 20%, while I end up paying the whole thing.



As I posted earlier, I didn't haggle over price except the doc fees. I actually would have paid a reasonable setup and any freight charges without bargaining - but the dealership never asked for them in the first place (so much for the old "the dealership has to charge these fees or they'll suffer" argument).



I'm a happy customer, who will gladly tell everyone who asks about my experience, and will travel out of my way to buy things from this dealership again. The things I buy there won't be items with negotiable prices, either. They'll be things like filters, tires, chains, accessories, parts, gear, cleaning supplies, and any of the myriad of other things we riders are always throwing money at. Because of the way I was treated, I'll be in their shop when I buy these things, and in several years when it becomes time to replace my current cruiser (I bought a sportbike from the dealership this time), I'll very likely go see these people first.



As a salesman, which would you prefer for yourself and your dealership - my $500 now, or my continued business, loyalty, and free advertising for years to come? You might want to ask the owner or business manager of the dealership where you work the same question, too...
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Old 05-19-2003, 06:35 PM   #15
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Default Re: A Salesman Speaks

I can understand your feelings as a person trying to make a living and I always take that into consideration when making a deal on anything. However, being that this is America, "land of the free", you also have the right to find a better job which pays you more. If your statement was totally true, then you wouldn't mind paying top dollar for gas, bread, airplane tickets, etc. Everyone has to learn to compete, no matter what industry or product it may be. Otherwise, you will end up like a typical union worker who is overpaid, underskilled and working for a company in an industry who is being left behind by the competiton (i.e. American Airlines).
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Old 05-19-2003, 10:19 PM   #16
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Default Re: A Salesman Speaks

Sir, I'd just like to say that I have total respect for your statment. More true words could not be spoken on the subject
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Old 05-20-2003, 04:58 AM   #17
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Default Re: Set-up and Dock fees?

I don't have a problem with paying a fair price for a bike, or any other product. I do have a problem with paying 20~30% mark-up on certain vehical's ( GSX1100G's?) However I can exercise my right as a consumer and shop elsewhere. Obviously dealers have to make a living too, but some of them are flat rude. I got the evil eye from a sales manager recently when I had the temerity to ask why a certain manufacturer listed an MSRP about 25% less than their price on what he admited was a "real slow seller" It was all I could do not to laugh in his face when he told me it was because of the lovely "new facility I would be buying the bike at, If I wanted to buy from tent in a gravel parking lot I might get MSRP" When I pointed out that other manufacturer's had nice shops too but they sold at MSRP, he rememberd something he had to do and disapeared. That's the kind of crap that's flat annoying.
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Old 05-20-2003, 05:39 AM   #18
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Default Re: Not In Texas

You will not pay taxes from another state. As you mentioned, you will have to pay the tax if you register the bike and put a plate on it in your own state. However, if you are buying an off road bike, you will not pay any tax, call around and check.



I bought an 1999 XR400 in Wyoming, brought it home and registered it here in colorado and paid only Colorado taxes when I applied for the title. My buddy is doing the same right now with a KTM he purchased from Illinios.



On top of that, when I bought the XR, I had no FREIGHT, SETUP or PAPER WORK FEES. My local dealer wanted MSRP + $800 for the above mentioned. I would have had to pay taxes either way if I wanted to license the bike.
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Old 05-20-2003, 05:55 AM   #19
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Default Re: A Salesman Speaks

I'm a salesman at a four-line dealership here in San Diego, and I agree with you 100%!
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Old 05-20-2003, 05:56 AM   #20
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Default Re: A Salesman Speaks

I'll agree with you that a CBR600RR COSTS the same coming from the Honda Factory. However, I guarantee you that you will pay amazingly different out the door prices depending on where you live for the bike. You are confused with regards to COST and Price.



Do I need the $100-500 more than you? Of course I do, I work just as hard as you do. I'd love to see dealers go the "No Haggle" route and charge fair prices for bikes and eliminate commissioned sales people completely. Pay you a reasonable salary and require you know something about the bikes.



My dealers don't stock anything other than oil, spark plugs and some apparel. The sales people know absolutely nothing about the bikes. The people behind the counter at my shop don't even know who makes the bike I need parts for when one is sitting on the floor directly behind me. I've been asked "who makes that bike, its it an ATV or a Motorcycle?"



One of the local dealers here lives in my neighborhood and has 2 Vipers in his garage, wonder how the hell he could afford those with your analogy? Your working conditions are your problem and something you should negotiate with your employer. I shouldn't have to cough up more money due to your personal situation.
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