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Old 02-02-2007, 10:41 AM   #31
seruzawa
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Default Re: It's Official: Hoard the Hogs Now.

The Fraternal Brotherhood of Union Workers always sticks together. That is until one of those Brother's companies goes under. Then you find that the other unions are suddenly unwilling to let these displaced "Brothers" join their personal little family rackets.
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Old 02-02-2007, 10:45 AM   #32
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Default Re: It's Official: Hoard the Hogs Now.

Why insult people you don't know? Labor-management disputes over compensation is the way of the world. In your view, management is always right and labor is always wrong?
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Old 02-02-2007, 10:53 AM   #33
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Default Re: Not exactly

KP- With a few weeks of proper training you can take an entire High School graduating class and have them do assembly line production. I'm not saying that they would have the same skill level as a 10 year employee but it's entirely possible to do. Labor workers are the easiest part of the labor pool to replace. The people that make the decisions in management effect the company in way that is greatly magnified compared to the labor pool. Strikes hurt the company, but management's ability to change the workforce is (for the labor pool) much worse than the strike itself.

When the Air-traffic Controllers went on strike Regan fired them. They were replaced because they didn't understand that the employer (in that case the Fed Gov't) OWNED the job- not the union.

What HD is asking for does not effect the average HD employee nearly as bad as the Union would have you believe. If paying for part of your health care is your trade-off in keeping your job and you know you get a 4% cost of living increase every year and on top of that you get a pay raise because the Fed is raising the minimum wage (which is directly tied to your contract) then the money you think you loose paying for something (health care) you get mostly on the house is inconsequential at that point. They will suck up one year of "break-even" in order to keep a job. Ask a Delta pilot what they think and after the bath that they took they'd just laugh and tell the employees to take the deal.
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Old 02-02-2007, 10:55 AM   #34
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Default Re: It's Official: Hoard the Hogs Now.

It's hard to get people to cross a picket line. With current models they will negotiate an end but...That is why I suspect the next model will built differently i.e offshore but assembled here.. Harley will say enough of this we don't want to go down the tubes like Ford. The union is really screwing themselves in the long term, in my opinion.
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Old 02-02-2007, 10:57 AM   #35
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Hey I think we agree. I would just use a different method.. I wouldn't give them COLA or tie it to the min wage. No long-term structural things. But I would give them a share in the profits like I said.
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Old 02-02-2007, 10:58 AM   #36
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Default Re: It's Official: Hoard the Hogs Now.

I'd be cool with "Built by American Robots".
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Old 02-02-2007, 11:01 AM   #37
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Default Re: Some clarification

Don't forget the bit about building new modern engines.
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Old 02-02-2007, 11:03 AM   #38
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Default Re: Some clarification

Points 1 and 2 are reasonable

Point 3 happens with many companies already

Point 4 (unless you are an Exec or in Management) will will never agree on this and I'm fine with that.

Point 5- Unless you are going into the Armed Services there is NO need for a signing bonus in ANY job. It's quite common place now days, but I believe you don't REWARD people for work that they have not produced. Pro Sports, Fortune 500, Mom's Flower Shop- it doesn't matter. Pay the bonus in the first quarter, after you assess the work done.
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Old 02-02-2007, 11:44 AM   #39
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Default Re: It's Official: Hoard the Hogs Now.

I hope the union keeps on thinking like you, 'cause I love laughing at them, seeing as how I grew up in Flint. Michigan was the canary in the coal mine, brothers... wake up & smell the coffee, already.



I guarandamtee you that the governors of Alabama, South Carolina and maybe even Mississippi have already called H-D to explain the labor laws in their state, and describing the infrastructure they've already built for the likes of BMW, Hyundai and DaimlerChrysler.



Final assembly of "Made in the USA" stuff (with 80% content made outside of North America, even) can happen anywhere in the US, after all...

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Old 02-02-2007, 11:47 AM   #40
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Default Re: It's Official: Hoard the Hogs Now.

What do you think of pricing yourself out of a job in the name of solidarity? How classic is that?

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