Motorcycle.com

naco_traficante · 05-20-2005, 08:44 AM

Would YOU trust your accounting to someone who looks like a Harley rider ?

First posst !

seruzawa · 05-20-2005, 08:54 AM

Used Harleys for a song soon. The much predicted collapse is here!!

Ashley · 05-20-2005, 09:00 AM

Here's my opinion, which stems from 12 years of dealing with H-D: It's another frivolous suit looking for a quick cash settlement. If you didn't know the market and couldn't see that H-D's years of rapid growth weren't reaching market saturation, you didn't actually talk to a dealer, or anyone else that lives the lifestyle and should take responsibility for your own investing. Harley isn't an Enron/Worldcom/Tyco. At its core, H-D is is a manufacturing company, and treating the stock as a boutique growth stock over the past couple of years was wrong in the first place. Where were all the lawyers to sue over too-fast growth and their clients making too much money? No one is criminal until someone else loses money is the American market message I get... but that's another rant (litigeous America is part of the reason I spend so much time abroad, so I'm extremely biased here folks!).

I have a very narrow stock portfolio these days: only five companies. My major investments are out-of-country real estate developments, and fixed CDs. So I'm not averse to risk, and I knowingly accept them. But, two of the five companies whose stock I have have both been hit with, and victoriously settled out of court, similar class-action suits. It stinks to have to wait out the settlement with a depressed stock price, but that's the market. Again, if you're growing rapidly to reach market demand, it's eventually going to be met, and anyone that couldn't see it coming in H-D's case, in my opinion, didn't do their homework and should mea culpa, not sue. H-D's not going anywhere, wait for the market panic to cease and the stock to rise...

Before anyone cries "foul" that we're defending Harley, do your research: I like Harley's product, so does Fonzie. Sean and Gabe don't quite "get" it, Pete pretty much likes everything. From the business end, I'm not too personally thrilled about the company -- in 12 years, we've never been able to sell them an online ad, or convert them to the online marketing ideal. We @MO strongly disagree with that philosophy, and have spent a lot of time, energy and resources trying to convert that mindset, all to no avail. So Harley is a loss-leader for MO, but you don't see us litigating over it now, do you?

agrantz · 05-20-2005, 09:04 AM

If bike sales plummet, I wonder how they'll unload all of the unsold costumes?

Buzglyd · 05-20-2005, 09:05 AM

I thought all Harley riders were accountants and dentists so I guess I would trust my accounting to one. My teeth too!

nokneedragin · 05-20-2005, 09:13 AM

I guess their Village people clothing sales numbers are correct. Clothes they know how much they sold, bikes they fudge afew numbers.

Basically it sounds like a standard marketing statement, that painted a little to rosie of a picture.

The stock will rise again

sarnali · 05-20-2005, 09:18 AM

I for one find it incomprehensible that a paragon of American Industry like Harley would resort to any unscrupulous, dare I say it......."Asian" buisness practices.

Next you'll be trying to tell me they make Fords in Mexico or something...

BMW4VWW · 05-20-2005, 09:27 AM

I thought you folks ran some ads for Buell, didn't you? Perhaps HD see MO readers as not being in their target market. Van

SV650GLEN · 05-20-2005, 09:34 AM

Lot's of attorney Hog Riders also!

maladg · 05-20-2005, 09:34 AM

Pantless chaps, Village People looks, ball tickler beards and silly faux lids aside, this business of suing over stock price results & esoteric FI accounting "inside baseball" is just the pits.

Sarbanes - Oxley stinks. The law firms specializing in stock price suits - mostly west coast based, ain't they? - stinks. Sptizer stinks. CT yankee law firms stink.

"Stuffed distribution channel" indeed. Now here is a REALLY smart business model: lets build WAY more product that can be sold so as to prop up stock prices in the near term so that.....so that what? Get the rubes to buy in so HD can channel the bucks into plant improvements to improve product to improve sales thusly improving profits? Sounds like a dasterdly thing to do! Quick someone - call Dudley Do Right! And Eliot Spitzer!

Forbesish grumblings aside, the drop in sales appears to have caught the Mother Ship by suprise. One Metro ATL HD dealership has been advertising on a local talk radio station that they have plenty of EVERYTHING in stock.

Bah, humbug. Think I'll go pick apart some narratives my staff wrote this week. That will make me feel better! And if it don't...I'll just tell 'em to knock of early. Hey, I feel better already!

05-20-2005, 08:44 AM	#1
naco_traficante Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 466	Re: Class Action Filled Against Harley-Davidson Would YOU trust your accounting to someone who looks like a Harley rider ? First posst !

05-20-2005, 08:54 AM	#2
seruzawa Robby Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: 8501 ft. Posts: 16,803	It's the Beginning of the End!!! Used Harleys for a song soon. The much predicted collapse is here!! __________________ I've seen things you people wouldn't believe. Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched c-beams glitter in the dark near the Tanhauser Gate. All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in the rain.

05-20-2005, 09:00 AM	#3
Ashley Founding Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 7	Re: Class Action Filled Against Harley-Davidson Here's my opinion, which stems from 12 years of dealing with H-D: It's another frivolous suit looking for a quick cash settlement. If you didn't know the market and couldn't see that H-D's years of rapid growth weren't reaching market saturation, you didn't actually talk to a dealer, or anyone else that lives the lifestyle and should take responsibility for your own investing. Harley isn't an Enron/Worldcom/Tyco. At its core, H-D is is a manufacturing company, and treating the stock as a boutique growth stock over the past couple of years was wrong in the first place. Where were all the lawyers to sue over too-fast growth and their clients making too much money? No one is criminal until someone else loses money is the American market message I get... but that's another rant (litigeous America is part of the reason I spend so much time abroad, so I'm extremely biased here folks!). I have a very narrow stock portfolio these days: only five companies. My major investments are out-of-country real estate developments, and fixed CDs. So I'm not averse to risk, and I knowingly accept them. But, two of the five companies whose stock I have have both been hit with, and victoriously settled out of court, similar class-action suits. It stinks to have to wait out the settlement with a depressed stock price, but that's the market. Again, if you're growing rapidly to reach market demand, it's eventually going to be met, and anyone that couldn't see it coming in H-D's case, in my opinion, didn't do their homework and should mea culpa, not sue. H-D's not going anywhere, wait for the market panic to cease and the stock to rise... Before anyone cries "foul" that we're defending Harley, do your research: I like Harley's product, so does Fonzie. Sean and Gabe don't quite "get" it, Pete pretty much likes everything. From the business end, I'm not too personally thrilled about the company -- in 12 years, we've never been able to sell them an online ad, or convert them to the online marketing ideal. We @MO strongly disagree with that philosophy, and have spent a lot of time, energy and resources trying to convert that mindset, all to no avail. So Harley is a loss-leader for MO, but you don't see us litigating over it now, do you?

05-20-2005, 09:04 AM	#4
agrantz Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 5	Re: Class Action Filled Against Harley-Davidson If bike sales plummet, I wonder how they'll unload all of the unsold costumes?

05-20-2005, 09:05 AM	#5
Buzglyd Founding Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Posts: 10,137	Re: Class Action Filled Against Harley-Davidson I thought all Harley riders were accountants and dentists so I guess I would trust my accounting to one. My teeth too! __________________ Jay Leno: "President Obama released his tax returns. It turns out he made $900,000 less in 2011 than he did in 2010. You know what that means? Even Obama is doing worse under President Obama."

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05-20-2005, 09:13 AM	#6
nokneedragin Founding Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 771	Re: Class Action Filled Against Harley-Davidson I guess their Village people clothing sales numbers are correct. Clothes they know how much they sold, bikes they fudge afew numbers. Basically it sounds like a standard marketing statement, that painted a little to rosie of a picture. The stock will rise again

05-20-2005, 09:18 AM	#7
sarnali Founding Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 3,416	Re: Class Action Filled Against Harley-Davidson I for one find it incomprehensible that a paragon of American Industry like Harley would resort to any unscrupulous, dare I say it......."Asian" buisness practices. Next you'll be trying to tell me they make Fords in Mexico or something...

05-20-2005, 09:27 AM	#8
BMW4VWW Founding Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Posts: 1,833	Re: Class Action Filled Against Harley-Davidson I thought you folks ran some ads for Buell, didn't you? Perhaps HD see MO readers as not being in their target market. Van

05-20-2005, 09:34 AM	#9
SV650GLEN Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 56	Re: Class Action Filled Against Harley-Davidson Lot's of attorney Hog Riders also! __________________ SV650 GLEN

05-20-2005, 09:34 AM	#10
maladg Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Rock throwing distance from Home Despot HQ Posts: 1,141	Re: Class Action Filled Against Harley-Davidson Pantless chaps, Village People looks, ball tickler beards and silly faux lids aside, this business of suing over stock price results & esoteric FI accounting "inside baseball" is just the pits. Sarbanes - Oxley stinks. The law firms specializing in stock price suits - mostly west coast based, ain't they? - stinks. Sptizer stinks. CT yankee law firms stink. "Stuffed distribution channel" indeed. Now here is a REALLY smart business model: lets build WAY more product that can be sold so as to prop up stock prices in the near term so that.....so that what? Get the rubes to buy in so HD can channel the bucks into plant improvements to improve product to improve sales thusly improving profits? Sounds like a dasterdly thing to do! Quick someone - call Dudley Do Right! And Eliot Spitzer! Forbesish grumblings aside, the drop in sales appears to have caught the Mother Ship by suprise. One Metro ATL HD dealership has been advertising on a local talk radio station that they have plenty of EVERYTHING in stock. Bah, humbug. Think I'll go pick apart some narratives my staff wrote this week. That will make me feel better! And if it don't...I'll just tell 'em to knock of early. Hey, I feel better already!