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Old 03-30-2004, 10:53 AM   #41
Winger4Life
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Default Re: Defending Harley

What kind of logic is that?



I guess Honda should have done the same? Sorry folks about the cracked frames. It was not our fault that we got contaminated aluminum rods from our suppliers. We have since changed suppliers so everything is good.



If you bike falls in the VIN range we will sell you a kit to fix the defect we should have caught in our quality control testing. We f'd up, but you should pay for our mistake.



What kind of service is that!??!!?? If it were like that, and my bike was in the VIN range, I would NEVER buy a Honda again. But thankfully Honda did the right thing by recalling the affected bikes, and fixing them...for FREE.





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Old 03-30-2004, 10:58 AM   #42
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Default Re: Decision on Harley TwinCam Suit

Agreed on everything, except you're only half right on the FJR; yep, the wait sucks and is silly, but it costs less than anything else in its class.



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Old 03-30-2004, 11:11 AM   #43
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Default Re: Decision on Harley TwinCam Suit

LOL...he should be careful using the treadmills at your gym too; I heard that a belt broke on one once and the runner got pitched off and did a handlebar/digital display slapper at an estimated 18 mph and got a serious road rash on his butt.



Of course the manufacturer claims it's not a defect and is denying any responsibility.
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Old 03-30-2004, 11:28 AM   #44
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Default Re: Decision on Harley TwinCam Suit

Notice I said "smart" advertiser. And American car makers in the 70's and 80's were certainly not acting smart. In fact, they did enormous damage to their brands that has taken decades, a lot of money, and a lot of work to begin to fix. And it almost killed them. They were arrogant at first–just did not take the Japanese competition seriously until it was too late and they were way behind.



You must admit that American cars are far better from a quality and performance standpoint, relative to import brands, than they were 30 years agoÂ…or even ten years ago. In fact, weÂ’d probably think they were even greater if we didnÂ’t have Honda, Toyota, BMW, Mercedes and the other usual suspects to compare them with (but then again, weÂ’d probably all still be driving K-cars). You can thank the Japanese and other quality imports (and the American manufacturers who decided to get their heads out of their asses) for that. American cars, by and large, are actually very good today, and getting better all the time. That is a direct result of learning from your competition and your mistakes.



Just like Harley had to get smarter to survive.



And if thereÂ’s one thing Harley is not, itÂ’s a dumb marketer.



If you still think American cars are "bad," youÂ’re still tainted by the stench of the old Big Three. Detroit still has work to do, but theyÂ’ve come a long way.



Nothing kills a bad product faster than good advertising.

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Old 03-30-2004, 11:36 AM   #45
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Default Re: Decision on Harley TwinCam Suit

Good point. I saw an ad for the L.L. Bean Edition of some Subaru. I'm thinking to myself, "someone is actually going to buy this friggin' thing."



Sort of like the 100th Anniversary Harleys. You might have to keep them another 100 years for them to be worth anything.
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Old 03-30-2004, 12:33 PM   #46
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Default Re: Defending Harley

Honda DID do the same for as long as they could. They hid the engine overheating and frame cracking for a year and a half on their superbly crafted machine. Since the word got out, and sales sucked, THEN and only THEN they FINALLY did something. Let's say you bought a bike in that VIN range. Would YOU be happy with a rewelded frame on a 20 grand plus bike? I know I wouldn't. I want a NEW frame or a NEW bike for my 20G. Give the rewelded one to someone else. And if that frame breaks again outside the standard warranty is Honda gonna pony up to fix it again? Harley gave a 5 year 50,000 on their cam problem. Seriously doubt Honda is gonna give you a new frame at 50,000 if it goes belly up again. To me, frame defects REQUIRE a new frame, not some 3rd party fix that Honda approved. They went the cheap route and are praying they don't break again.
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Old 03-30-2004, 01:49 PM   #47
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....on their superbly crafted machine



lol. I knew someone would talk smack soon enough.... Obviously you know little about what actually went down....Honda did not hide anything. Honda, as any manufacturer, needs to investigate defects when they appear. Is it common? What is it? How does it happen? What conditions? Then they can start to come up with what the actual cause of the problem is. Once they know what the cause is, they need to come up with a fix, which also takes time, as they want to make sure it is correct.



As for sales, the Honda dealers in my area do not seem to have any problems selling Wings. I see them come in, and I see them go out. Sure, they are not Honda's most popular model (I believe the l33t CBR 1000 RRs are now), but they are selling.



I know this might be hard for a Harley owner to believe, but the Gold Wing does not cost $20+k. I got my '02 for 15k.



LOL. Mr Engineer, thanks for the advice, but I think i will trust the Engineers at Honda over your opinion about the frame.



The cheap route? What are you talking about?





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Old 03-30-2004, 02:58 PM   #48
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Default Re: Decision on Harley TwinCam Suit

Well we know thats bull*****, a Harley would do 80 mph if you dropped it off a cliff.
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Old 03-30-2004, 03:00 PM   #49
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I was going by the MCN artical, my bro has 35k hard miles on his Dyna Defender and no problems and others I know have close to that so WTF do I know...
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Old 03-30-2004, 03:05 PM   #50
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Well, ya' missed out, jellied eel and pub onions, washed down by a gallon of Harp Lager is quite a treat......Did you go to any Balti houses? I've never got good Indian food here like over there.. alu gobi and tandori chicken with one of those humongus fried bread things...Yummy
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