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Old 11-17-2000, 11:09 AM   #1
Colorado_F4
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Default Re: Howto: Take Action on US Land Closures

Comments like this are part of the problem. When motorcycle riders call environmentalists "enviro-nazis" and resort to name-calling such as "Ozone Al" it just widens the rifts between environmentalists and motorcyclists and other recreationists.



I consider myself to be an environmentalist first, and a motorcyclist 2nd. I don't ride off-road, but I'm not totally opposed to doing so. What bothers me is when people have this attitude that it's either/or. Either we worry about the environment, OR we can have our off-road fun.



We know that we can do both. In your above post you gave a good suggestion, which is to create quieter bikes. There are plenty of other things that can be done, such as making cleaner bikes (less emissions), more fuel-efficient bikes, and most of all, by encouraging riders to do their part to help to not destroy the land they enjoy playing on.



The same thing is going on with snowmobiles and jet-skis. Sadly, what happens is that both the manufacturers and the users decry any plans to try to create cleaner machinery. Then environmentalists are left with only one option: ban them, since they won't voluntarily clean up their act. I can't blame them (and like I said I'm actually one of them). I hope motorcycle manufacturers will be more proactive and will do what they can to minimize environmental impacts of the sport. I think Honda is leading the way with their cleaner bikes that already meet California's 2008(?) tough air-quality standards. This is the kind of thing that will keep it from being an us vs. them battle. There's no reason we can't all work together.....
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Old 11-17-2000, 02:32 PM   #2
bikearch
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Default Re: Howto: Take Action on US Land Closures

True manure is a common fertilizer it is also true that is contains a high amount un-germanated weed/exotic plant seeds. Most of these weeds spread at unbelievable rate and in time would choke at a signifigant portion of the native flora. You can extrapolate on the effects this has on the food chain.



Also maybe you could spot the (1 OF MANY)hyprocrisy in the USFS/BLM LAND MANGEMENT POLICIES.
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Old 11-17-2000, 09:26 PM   #3
BlownAwayIG
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Default Re: Howto: Take Action on US Land Closures

It's no wonder why we keep losing OHV areas. Look at some of the comments. Some people just dont get it. The tree huggers, owl lovers, green peace and the sierra club all have the same things in common. One cause, one belief, and unity. Hell, just like the speech says, Hog riders got no use for Harley Riders, Sport bikers got no use for Harleys/Cruisers, hell even dirts bikers have gotten stupid, 2 strokes vs 4 strokes, 4 wheelers have no use for SUV's, and SUVer's have no clue. Mtn Bikers think they're above everyone else because they're people powered, Horse riders think this is the wild west and they don't fit into OUR predicament. Hikers and climbers, seen the face of any good climbing area, petons, axe and pick marks,chaulk and power bar wrappers, and seen the parking lots of these places, how many Excursions, expeditions, tahoes, 4 runners, cherokees and path finders did it take to get them to the HIKE. Lets not forget those Jet skiers and Bass Fisherman, their not immune. Pre-mix from a Bass boat ain't no different. Anyone have a landscape business in LA, can you say good bye to weed wackers and gas blowers. Anyone fly model airplanes, those area's are gone too...



The one thing we'll all have in common soon, we'll all be back yard bikers, arm chair climbers, recliner racers, and corona drinking story tellers of how it used to be.



Get together and unite, one cause one fight. It works for the other side. Take a lesson from Gun Control.
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Old 11-17-2000, 09:38 PM   #4
BlownAwayIG
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Default Re: Howto: Take Action on US Land Closures

You know, dog versus horse, it's not about the small animal kill issue or even the waste issue, If that were the case humans wouldn't be allowed in. Human's kill more small animals each and everyday than any dog domestic or not. Human's leave more waste than any animal alive. It's the american west mentality. My Australian shepherd hasn't killed anything but a few bugs, and hikers leave more human and manufactured waste. My dog doesn't leave beer bottles at the beach, and he's not allowed at most of them...Some laws are still written with the old west mentality. But most are written with a human arrogence and lack of self responsibility or accountability.



It's easier to blame something that can't defend itself. Only human's wage war on themselves and everything else alive, seek ways to destroy it's own race and succeeded.
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Old 11-18-2000, 02:28 PM   #5
CYCLE_MONKEY
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Default Re: Howto: Take Action on US Land Closures

While I won't tell you guys not to write in to the Feds, I told them my feelings on the subject, and this is what I got back, verbatim:



"Thank you for your comments on the President's Roadless Area Initiative.

The formal comment period ended on July 17, 2000. Your comments will be

included in the archive for the record."



Does this smack of King Klington telling us all to off, or what? Glad this ******* is outta here soon, and his little "Gore-bot" lost the election, no matter how much he whines for a recount so they can stuff the ballot box. I hope Lewinski gave him Aids.
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Old 11-18-2000, 02:38 PM   #6
CYCLE_MONKEY
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Default Re: Howto: Take Action on US Land Closures

Actually, much as I hate King Klinton and his Gore-bot, I agree that the popular vote, and not the electoral college should determine the Presidency. Fortunately, in this case, we'll be getting Bush instead of "Ozone Al". Mark my words, he's won Florida, and thus, the election. If I'm wrong, I'll personally write here to this forum, and admit my error. Keep an eye on the news, my friend.

P.S I lived in Gunbarrel Estates (between Boulder and Longmont, on the diagonal), from '75 to '80, and loved it. Beautiful country, visited it several times since, over the years. Wish I was back. No matter how things turn out, keep the shiny side up.
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Old 11-18-2000, 02:46 PM   #7
CYCLE_MONKEY
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Default Re: Howto: Take Action on US Land Closures

ANY fresh excrement, no matter the source, contains high levels of bile acids, and will kill plants where it drops. It is only after these acids break down that the excrement becomes fertilizer. The manure you buy has been composted. When was the last time you were hiking down a path and had to steer clear of some motorcycle crap? Those aholes riding the horses should be made to clean the trails up after the horses, and should have to register and pay fees like we do. Why is it only the motorized riders have to pay, and not everyone? I's not fair. I agree, we should ALL be mindful of the environment, and of others, but after seeing the results, I can say that horses tear up the trails worse, and leave more waste behind.
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Old 11-18-2000, 02:48 PM   #8
CYCLE_MONKEY
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Default Re: Howto: Take Action on US Land Closures

Absolutely, I'm with ya 100%.
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Old 11-19-2000, 11:00 AM   #9
bikearch
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Default Re: Howto: Take Action on US Land Closures

You touched upon a issue that could/will be the downfall of public use of our lands. That is the diversity of users. Why the USFS has not come up with any sort of land plan that would accomadate everyone is beyound me. Being a Landscape Architect I have devolopement such said plans for state and county held lands. It can be done. If we could ban togehter and formulate a lodgical plant that included all considerations then and present them in a public forum, with a dynamic .....soory just dreaming.
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Old 11-19-2000, 02:34 PM   #10
CYCLE_MONKEY
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Default Re: Howto: Take Action on US Land Closures

Motor vehicles put out mostly Co, carbon MONoxide, not Co2, carbon DIoxide.
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