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vmxxx 08-30-2001 07:31 PM

Re: Harley Davidson to Retire from Racing
if youhave a ten dollar head, wear a ten dollar helmet.

john 08-30-2001 09:24 PM

Re: Harley Davidson to Retire from Racing
Sorry, yes in a race there are lapped Duc's, Hondas, Kawasaki's, etc, but there is also one on the podium every race. When you brag about *finally* getting an 8th place finish after 9 years.....that is not competitive.

can you say it with me SUZUKA. 8 hour endurance race? yeah, thats about 500 miles.....sheesh. i guess some people just don't ever really live.

john 08-30-2001 09:29 PM

Re: Harley Davidson to Retire from Racing
I wasnt implying anything in my was just numbers. I was just trying to throw some ballpark figures out there. those were just the english bikes. I am sure when you count all of them, inc. goldwing and in the US, honda might sellcloser to 100,000 FI bikes a year. As harley has more and more initiative to go to FI b/c of emmisions/performance, i am sure they will sell more FI bikes than honda.

john 08-30-2001 09:34 PM

Re: An analogy
A one legged man playing hockey?

john 08-30-2001 09:45 PM

Re: Harley Davidson to Retire from Racing
I know what you are saying, with the make it what you want it bit, but i read every issue of Hot Bike, American Iron, and Cruiser magazine, in addition to PB, Bike, Superbike, Motorcyclist, Sportrider, CycleWorld.

It seems to me the cruiser world is getting stale. Smae thing, different paint. Maybe a few different lines, but cookie cutter bikes none-the-less. I do notice the details on the cruisers (i think the european customs are the only innovative ones), but they do not seem to raise any kind of bar, performance wise, value wise, or visually. I think everything that can be built, has been built. Why else would people like Arlen Ness turn an eye towards sportbikes? Because they offer the chance to make something actually different. What you get is pretty much what you pay for. You dont need to upgrade the motor, suspension, brakes, and chassis to make a well balanced motorcycle. A few cosmetic bits and you are there. Likewise, the ability to do extreme stuff is there, as well. To me, sportbikes just offer more diversity than cruisers.

john 08-30-2001 09:46 PM

Re: Too Bad, I hope they come back soon............
The VR 1000 is/was liquid cooled, i think.

alik 08-31-2001 04:34 AM

Re: Harley Davidson to Retire from Racing
Sad! Very sad! It is an end of an epoch!

Ever since HD resurrected it's racing side, I kept looking forward to each and every AMA race. Even seeing HDs in dead last was great, because THERE WERE HARLEY's RACING! That alone in my book was a major achievement.

And now it ends. The feeling of pride that our own, home team is leaving the field.

So sad...

doohan 08-31-2001 05:05 AM

Re: Harley Davidson to Retire from Racing
So thats attempt to be competitive and they bail out? Sounds like a big cop out to me. Besides most of the V-rod was developed by porsche. I'm no Harley fan but I'm disappointed, besides the riders I don't think anyone really tried that hard to be competitive. How many major changes or revisions had they done to the VR1000? Maybe now they will appreciate what the others involved in racing do to win the #1 plate. They should have stuck it out..they have some balls using money as an excuse.

ORR 08-31-2001 05:41 AM

Re: Harley Davidson to Retire from Racing
Sure it does! I live in Georgia, can I buy a new Harley in South Carolina? NO! I was told by a dealer that he could only sell a new Harley to someone that is in his sales area. This is set by Harley Davidson. Because of this lack of competition, the dealers can set their prices however they wish. This, is combined with the idea that a used Harley will be worth at least as much as you paid for it (if I remember this right, that was a promise made to buyers of '80s era 883s by Harley to increase sales) has created a market where dealers add a "premium" even when the supply is good (the dusty bikes sitting around for months that I mentioned). How else could I interperet this, but as support for gouging? I have nothing against the bikes. As you may have guessed, I went shopping for a Sportster, but I am completely disgusted by the pricing. If you enjoy having your fellow Americans rip you off while claiming patriotisim, fine. I suppose I can just get an old Bonneville. That way I can have my pushrod twin and good parts support.

PsychoBueller 08-31-2001 05:55 AM

Re: Harley Davidson to Retire from Racing
You wrote: "What benefit does H-D get out of racing that it cannot get elsewhere? If Harley wins races, there is no "race replica" type bike that it's customer can then run out and buy. Therefore, racing gives no direct benefits."

I say: EXACTLY! This is why Buell should take over the race effort, develop new technologies and build a real American Superbike that you actually can buy.

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