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Old 02-05-2003, 01:51 PM   #81
captainwhoopass
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Default Re: Longride, are you serious?

It's nice to have someone with some real knowledge weigh in on this. Thanks.
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Old 02-05-2003, 01:58 PM   #82
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Default Re: Longride, are you serious?

I really don't care about your $12. Spam the management, if you like.
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Old 02-05-2003, 02:09 PM   #83
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Default Re: Is The V-Twin Falling From Favor?

>>"...weather [sic] or not I was going to DOUBLE my horse power over the next 1000 rpm's (possibly leading to a crash) "



That is an absurd statement. You think your 999 has any less ability to do that? It is what? 125hp or so at the tire? and 600's are 100 or so? But since they are inline 4 they are MORE dangerous? come on....<<



This is absolutely true. The issue is not the absolute horsepower, but the shape of the power (or torque) curve. The VTwin (or for that matter, most big 4s) have much flatter torque curves than the 600 sportbikes, which in turn are flatter than a highly tuned 2-stroke (eg TZ250). If you are accelerating out of a turn at moderate rpm, so that your bike produces, say 50hp, but with another 1000 rpm, that jumps to 100, throttle control becomes extremely critical. If that same additional 1000 rpm only adds another 20hp, it will be much easier to ride close to the limit.



This gets even more tricky if you are in a part of the rpm range where the torque curve is sharply rising -- if you start to break traction and the tire spins, the rpm quickly jumps, producing even more torque, spinning more. Then when you back off, torque plummets, the tire hooks instantly ... can you say "HIGH SIDE?" On many VTwins (and often with bigger 4s), you are likely to be at a point where the torque is falling as rpm rise so if you spin, torque falls -- in effect, a form of traction control. It has been reported that Yamaha remapped the black box on the M1 GP bike so that in the rpm range used exiting corners, they acheived just that result.



This same trait (flatter torque curves) is what makes the 4-stroke 220 hp GP bikes so much easier to ride than the 170-180 hp 2-strokes. The 2-strokes have a power curve like a light switch. Real fine line between bogging and highsiding!



For this reason, I would rather see inexperienced riders on something like a 1200 Bandit than an R6. The issue is not necessarily a matter of how many cylinders or how they are arranged, is is a matter of how the bike is tuned.



Cheers

Bob
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Old 02-05-2003, 02:21 PM   #84
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Default Re: Longride, are you serious?

So far as I can determine, there still is no indication of any of the Japanese manufacturers actually selling SM bikes. Sure, they will offer contingencies and all, and they may have some factory supported racers as well, but none of the dealers or anyone else I have talked to expects them to actually sell a SM bike that soon (if ever). Unless they actually DO introduce such a bike in 2004, Dork STILL did not get it right!
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Old 02-05-2003, 02:24 PM   #85
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Default Re: Longride, are you serious?

BTW, anyone who would not recognize your alias as anything other than tongue-in-cheek hardly qualifies as intelligent in my estimation



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Old 02-05-2003, 02:36 PM   #86
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Default Re: English bike picks best 600 .....

Yeah, and their on-line version sucks (I still check it every day, though) -- mostly just teasers for what is in the print issue. During race season, they do have some good stuff on line.



Cheers

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Old 02-05-2003, 04:03 PM   #87
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Default Re: Is The V-Twin Falling From Favor?

Yes but you are missing my point.....that even the most powerful streetbikes, i e hayabusa, still has such a broad power curve.



Its like you are comparing Vtwin and I-4 configurations to that of thumpers and square 4 500's......when they are NOT that different.



And as far as implying the difference as being so great that they are dangerous? that is what i find absurd.



And you have to be REALLY STUPID to get yourself into too much trouble on an R6. i mean whacking it for all its worth at 10 grand in 1st and expect nothing to happen, that is stupid.
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Old 02-05-2003, 10:03 PM   #88
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Default Re: Longride, are you serious?

A fool and his money....
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Old 02-06-2003, 02:46 AM   #89
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Default Re: Is The V-Twin Falling From Favor?

Thank you again. You've provided me with more useful information than 100 dyno charts could provide. I guess time constraints prevent magazines from providing a real world evaluation but it would sure be nice before spending the dough.



I'm going to stick with your modifications for now. One gets a lot of bang for the buck that way. I'll ride the crap out of it and worry about upgrading the performance sometime down the road. I work from home so commuting's not an issue. It will mainly be a touring rig for me.
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Old 02-06-2003, 04:23 AM   #90
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Default Re: English bike picks best 600 .....

I hate the MCN website. It's just a bunch of teasers to sell the rag. I went there all the time when it had acual content.
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